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Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: msbaby] #442125 08/08/08 06:33 PM
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sweetkb713 Offline
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Originally Posted By: msbaby
As much as I love my children, I'm afraid that (here I go sounding selfish again?) I would accept and make the most out of a life without children in it if I couldn't have my own with my own eggs.


I guess I'm not really sure why you would think of yourself as selfish if you didn't have children. How is that selfish? At least, beyond the everyday selfishness that humans demonstrate in order to live normal, healthy lives.

If adopting children is too expensive, then what is so wrong with not having children? How on earth is it selfish? To me it sounds completely logical and rational.

I feel bad for people who adopt children with emotional issues. But biological children have issues, too. Kids aren't dogs. You can't give them back to the shelter. If you adopt a child with baggage, you take him/her to therapy, you work with him/her. Kids are work. It doesn't matter where they come from, they are work. I think people expect to pop out (or adopt) a kid and then magically be a happy Disney family. It doesn't work like that, no matter if the child is biological or not. I think there are a lot of parents out there who can't accept it. If they would, their lives would be a lot better because then they'd actually get the help they need and not brush the problem under the rug.

And don't you think it's a little bizarre to be implying that you'd be selfish if you didn't have kids when you're on a child free board? Or, is this NOT a child free board anymore? I'm awfully confused.

Where are all the moderators that were so active here a few months ago? Maybe they could explain a little better if this IS a board for child free people or just for people who don't have children.

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Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: sweetkb713] #442202 08/08/08 10:01 PM
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Naomi Baine Offline
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Sweetkb- Yeah, where ARE the mods? It seems like MNKDS is dying on it's feet right now. :[

Msbaby- If Sweetkb is right in guessing what you mean by saying you'd be "selfish not to have any kids"...Uh...Wow. On a CF board, no less? I'll admit, I have some respect for you, since you usually show care in what you post on here, but, wow. Try and think about the CF here, not everyone here is selfish because of one choice. Maybe you just meant that statement for yourself, but it does affect those around you.


... I saw a fox by the rabbit hole, you saw a prince from a fair tale ...
... He promised that he'd watch over you, turned out to be the fox we all knew ...
Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: Naomi Baine] #442228 08/08/08 11:43 PM
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Naomi - Just out of curiosity, what is your signature line from?

Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: sweetkb713] #442232 08/09/08 12:14 AM
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Interesting Msbaby that you only mention foreign adoptions in your argument that IVF is cheaper than adoption.

Thirty seconds of Google search led me to Adopt.com, where the statistics on adoption costs are listed. If a child is adopted from the U.S. Foster Care system, the adoption fees are often waived. Yes, that's right, a zero cost adoption.

Private agencies are more expensive, $6,000-$30,000 and yes foreign adoptions are the most expensive, at $7,000-$30,000. BUT there are also state tax credits, reduced fees, loans, even an entire organization dedicated to making adoption affordable.

Adoption expense is a straw man. There is something else that prevents more people from adopting. Considering the popularity of IVF, I wonder what that could be.

Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: MiraKitty] #442277 08/09/08 05:49 AM
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Sweetkb- It's from the song "Run Rabbit Run" by the Hoosiers. :]


... I saw a fox by the rabbit hole, you saw a prince from a fair tale ...
... He promised that he'd watch over you, turned out to be the fox we all knew ...
Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: MiraKitty] #442488 08/09/08 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted By: MiraKitty
Interesting Msbaby that you only mention foreign adoptions in your argument that IVF is cheaper than adoption.


There is a lot more red tape to get through in the US than in places like China. I know someone who fostered a child who still had visitation rights with her mother - it was stressful for everyone involved. That girl was never going to be eligible for adoption, she was only in foster care because her mother was incompetent. So there is less of a chance of something like that happening when you go overseas.

I think another reason that a lot of people prefer to pay the bigger bucks is that they are essentially buying themselves a child. Yes, that's right. They want a child RIGHT NOW and go through hell and high water to raise the money. That's how desperate they are. As far as I know (from casually knowing a few people who have adopted from China), overseas adoptions move much faster than ones in the States.

I think some of those people need to pull in the reins a bit. Kids aren't puppies. And especially with some of those China adoptions, you pretty much get the child sight-unseen. I remember an article in the paper about a local couple who just knew that they were going to China to get "a girl." They didn't even know what orphanage they were going to until they got there.

At least those people are adopting. I wish there was more of a standardization in adoptions across the board, and I do wish it was more attractive than IVF. There are just too many kids who need good homes.

I guess the point is, there are just too many people who are too desperate. I feel sorry for the people who think a child will fill in whatever is "missing" and then find that it doesn't.

Last edited by sweetkb713; 08/09/08 10:05 PM.
Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Ch [Re: Naomi Baine] #442508 08/09/08 11:34 PM
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no frickin way would I give/sell someone else my eggs. To me it is immoral. One of the biggest reasons I am CF is because of my genetic profile. I see selling your eggs as being the epitome of self-centeredness. I do not want children because I do not want to reproduce, not just because I do not want the inconvenience of pregnancy or the responsibility of child-rearing.
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Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Child? [Re: msbaby] #442510 08/09/08 11:48 PM
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I've thought about donating my eggs from time to time -- hey, I'M not going to use them, right?

But then I thought about the implications of having "my child" wandering around out there. If I don't want kids, then how could I reconcile that fact?

I couldn't.

I am supportive of anyone who wants to donate eggs. God knows there are a lot of couples out there who are desperate for children.

But I don't think I would ever be able to do it.

Kim

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Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Child? [Re: sweetkb713] #442519 08/10/08 01:30 AM
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elle Offline
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Originally Posted By: sweetkb713
There is a lot more red tape to get through in the US than in places like China. I know someone who fostered a child who still had visitation rights with her mother - it was stressful for everyone involved. That girl was never going to be eligible for adoption, she was only in foster care because her mother was incompetent. So there is less of a chance of something like that happening when you go overseas.



Not just the red tape - I think the authorities put prospective adoptive parents through an emotional wringer, they want to know everything from financial stuff to psychological profile and then they still treat the application as suspicious. It seems that couples going for IVF are at least treated with sympathy and kindness in comparison, and maybe that is why it appears "easier" to try IVF first before putting yourself through adoption hell.


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Re: Would You Sell Eggs to Give Somebody Else a Child? [Re: elle] #442534 08/10/08 03:28 AM
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msbaby Offline OP
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Hey y'all I was not making a statement that I felt I WAS being selfish that I would not consider selling my eggs; with the question mark I meant to indicate that I wondered if some might consider me to be.

A few of my CF friends that I know don't want children because they love their lives just like they are and don't want to take time out for child rearing. Some of these women would be willing (I asked) to donate or sell their eggs to enable someone else to conceive.

I don't think that I would do that anymore than I would have a child and willingly give it up for adoption. To me they are practically the same thing.

But y'all know what? I really wish that people who conceive naturally had to pass JUST HALF of the scrutiny of the people trying to adopt. If people had to prove they were ready to be parents before they had kids the world would be a better place.

As far as adopting from the foster system; that is a nightmare that I have observed up close in two different cases. Relatives seem to leave the children in the system without a care for years until some couple wants to adopt them and then everybody from aunts to great-grandmothers come out of the woodwork Or even better mom does a complete turn around and cleans up her life for a few weeks and takes the child back. In a month or so (however long it takes to completely traumatize the kid) the authorities inevitably have to remove the kid again. They can say the adoptive fees are free all they want, but the people I knew had unbelievable legal fees. It's my opinion that they would have been much better off to live their CF lives to the fullest and have left it alone rather than endure the heartache and misery the pursuit of children gave them.




Last edited by msbaby; 08/10/08 03:37 AM.
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