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LOL!Monica. I knew somebody in Thailand because I kept playing Dylan's music over and over who called him "Khun who cannot sing."
At least the Byrds kind of covered "Mr. Tambourine Man" and Peter, Paul, and Mary recorded a more melodic "Blowin' in the Wind."

From pretty much the same era and another impactful one for me.
I really like Trini Lopez' version with all of the "ooh ahs" but attatched no belief sytem importance to them!


IF I HAD A HAMMER (The Hammer Song)
words and music by Lee Hays and Pete Seeger

If I had a hammer
I'd hammer in the morning
I'd hammer in the evening
All over this land
I'd hammer out danger
I'd hammer out a warning
I'd hammer out love between my brothers and my sisters
All over this land

If I had a bell
I'd ring it in the morning
I'd ring it in the evening
All over this land
I'd ring out danger
I'd ring out a warning
I'd ring out love between my brothers and my sisters
All over this land

If I had a song
I'd sing it in the morning
I'd sing it in the evening
All over this land
I'd sing out danger
I'd sing out a warning
I'd sing out love between my brothers and my sisters
All over this land

Well I've got a hammer
And I've got a bell
And I've got a song to sing
All over this land
It's the hammer of justice
It's the bell of freedom
It's the song about love between my brothers and my sisters
All over this land

It's a good thing that I was not exposed to this song at a young and impressionable age or perhaps it would have become my dogmatic anthem.

Atheists Don�t Have No Songs (AKA The Atheist Hymnal)
As performed by Steve Martin and the Steep Creek Rangers

Chris�tians have their hymns and pages,
Hava Nag�i�la�s for the Jews,
Bap�tists have the rock of ages,
Athe�ists just sing the blues.

Ro�man�tics play Claire de Lune,
Born agains sing �He is risen,�
But no one ever wrote a tune,
For god�less ex�is�ten�tial�ism.

For Athe�ists there�s no good news. They�ll never sing a song of faith.
In their songs they have a rule: the �he� is al�ways low�er�case.
The �he� is al�ways low�er�case.

Some folks sing a Bach can�ta�ta,
Luther�ans get Christ�mas trees,
Athe�ist songs add up to nada,
But they do have Sun�days free.

Pentecostals sing to heav�en,
Cop�tics have the books of scrolls,
Nu�merol�o�gists can count to seven,
Athe�ists have rock and roll.

For Athe�ists there�s no good news. They�ll never sing a song of faith.
In their songs they have a rule: the �he� is al�ways low�er�case.
The �he� is al�ways low�er�case.

Atheists don�t have no songs.
Chris�tians have their hymns and pages,
Hava Nag�i�la�s for the Jews,
Bap�tists have the rock of ages,
Athe�ists just sing the blues.

Catholics dress up for Mass,
And lis�ten to, Gre�go�ri�an chants.
Athe�ists just take a pass, Watch foot�ball in their un�der�pants.
Watch foot�ball in their un�der�pants.

Atheists don�t have no songs.

"Atheists have rock and roll" I resent that Les (ha ha ha)

Here's another one for you. Dear God by Sarah Mclachlan

Dear God, hope you got the letter and
I pray you can make it better down here
I don't mean a big reduction in the price of beer
But all the people that you made in your image
See them starving on their feet
'Cause they don't get enough to eat from God
I can't believe in you

Dear God, sorry to disturb you but
I feel that I should be heard loud and clear
We all need a big reduction in amount of tears
And all the people that you made in your image
See them fighting in the street
'Cause they can't make opinions meet about God
I can't believe in you

Did you make disease and the diamond blue?
Did you make mankind after we made you?
And the devil too!

Dear God, don't know if you noticed but
Your name is on a lot of quotes in this book
And us crazy humans wrote it, you should take a look
And all the people that you made in your image
Still believing that junk is true
Well I know it ain't, and so do you, dear God
I can't believe in
I don't believe in

I won't believe in heaven and hell
No saints, no sinners, no devil as well
No pearly gates, no thorny crown
You're always letting us humans down
The wars you bring, the babes you drown
Those lost at sea and never found
And it's the same the whole world 'round
The hurt I see helps to compound
The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost
Is just somebody's unholy hoax
And if you're up there you'd perceive
That my heart's here upon my sleeve
If there's one thing I don't believe in
It's you
Dear God.

Freewill by Rush (this song is epic!!)


There are those who think that life has nothing left to chance take, A host of holy horrors to direct our aimless dance.

A planet of playthings,
We dance on the strings
Of powers we cannot perceive
"The stars aren't aligned,
Or the gods are malign..."
Blame is better to give than receive.

You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill.

There are those who think that they were dealt a losing hand,
The cards were stacked against them; they weren't born in Lotusland.

All preordained
A prisoner in chains
A victim of venomous fate.
Kicked in the face,
You can't pray for a place
In heaven's unearthly estate.

You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill.

Each of us
A cell of awareness
Imperfect and incomplete.
Genetic blends
With uncertain ends
On a fortune hunt that's far too fleet.

You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill.

Monica, bless your heart! "Dear God" and "Freewill" sure live up to one of my sayings- "mince garlic or parsley but not words."

That line "I don't mean a big reduction in the price of beer" got me to randomly think that if there is a god, I sure would not want to be in her/his/its place with all those religious, faithful (home team and betting-wise), and zealous adherents of the National Football League praying for an end to that plague and pestilence of an owners lockout. Whatever will people do on Sundays
(and Mondays and Thursdays). No pro football in the U.S., maybe that is what was meant by the "end of the world" prophesy.

THANK YOU!!!
Having said that I am agnostic/"without knowledge" why I am saying that. You see, without being coy, self-deprecating, or self-aggrandizing I am perplexed why this specific forum topic receives so many views. For example, yesterday without any new posts it received well over 200 "looks."- which means that people are actually going into the forum looking for it. Recently, on days that there have been posts it has been even higher. (Keeping in mind that topics like "Where in Outer Outer Outer Mongolia Can I get my Nose Pierced" or "My Pet Albino Miniature Mongoose Keeps Spitting Up" or "Are My Hiccups a Sign From Above?" will receive hundreds or more than likely thousands of clicks over time).

So if you posters can clue me in or the 99.889% of you who are "lurkers" can send me your positive (or negative?) energy as to why you follow this forum topic that would be super. In other words I do not have a good "fix" demographically or ideologically/philosophically who the readership is and agnostically perhaps never will. In the meantime I think I will just keep doing my thing and hopefully...

A lot of what I have been thinking or writing lately has been organized stream of consciousness (an oxymoron if I have ever heard of one!)- or could it just be not so "rapid flight of thought"?

When I am not consumed by unrequited love (lol) I have viewed this song as being highly agnostic as it has been one of my "signatures."

Both Sides Now by Joni Mitchell

ROWS and Flows of angel hair
And ice cream castles in the air
And feather canyons everywhere
I've looked at clouds that way

But now they only block the sun
They rain and snow on everyone
So many things I would have done
But clouds got in my way

I've looked at clouds from both sides now
From up and down, and still somehow
It's cloud illusions I recall
I really don't know clouds at all

Moons and Junes and Ferris wheels
The dizzy dancing way you feel
As every fairy tale comes real
I've looked at love that way

But now it's just another show
You leave 'em laughing when you go
And if you care, don't let them know
Don't give yourself away

I've looked at love from both sides now
From give and take, and still somehow
It's love's illusions I recall
I really don't know love at all

Tears and fears and feeling proud
To say "I love you" right out loud
Dreams and schemes and circus crowds
I've looked at life that way

Oh but now old friends are acting strange
They shake their heads, they tell me that I've changed
Well something's lost but something's gained
In living every day

I've looked at life from both sides now
From WIN and LOSE and still somehow
It's life's illusions I recall
I really don't know life at all

I've looked at life from both sides now
From up and down and still somehow
It's life's illusions I recall
I really don't know life at all

Phyliss has a neat forum topic about Spiders and Beetles. Which started me randomly thinking...

There are over 350,000 species of beetles on our planet. Were they placed here as part of a supreme being's "grand design"?
Talk about a "dominant" species as there are "only" about, including humans, 4,000 species of mammals!

O Me! O Life! by Walt Whitman


O ME! O life!... of the questions of these recurring;
Of the endless trains of the faithless�of cities fill�d with the foolish;
Of myself forever reproaching myself, (for who more foolish than I, and who more faithless?)
Of eyes that vainly crave the light�of the objects mean�of the struggle ever renew�d;
Of the poor results of all�of the plodding and sordid crowds I see around me;
Of the empty and useless years of the rest�with the rest me intertwined;
The question, O me! so sad, recurring�What good amid these, O me, O life?

Answer.

That you are here�that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.


Do you think that Whitman is saying that the meaning of life is life?
Is he more pessimistic or more optimistic about "the struggle ever renew'd."?
What does he mean by "what good amid these"?
Do you think that this is an agnostic-themed poem?

A couple or so years ago I wrote a short story titled "Cow Entitlement." As I looked at it recently I realized that I wrote an agnostic story without once ever really thinking about agnosticism as IT "is in the air that I breathe." The following is the last page or so of that story (keeping in mind that what you see is somewhat out of context) as it exempifies what my belief system is largely all about.


First, Wes reflected on the volcanic bounty that he had amassed that day. What in the world was he going to do with so much obsidian? He could only use so many pieces for bookends and �display� door stops. As many of the specimens were certainly of the showpiece variety; the large window sill in the front bedroom could be an appropriate viewing area. The terrace could highlight others as well as the rocarea in the side yard. A lot could be flaked and fashioned into objects of art at some point in time since he had brought with him a book on flint knapping and since he was planning on learning that craft some. Others could be given away to visiting family and friends. Oh yes, wouldn�t it be altruistic and thoughtful of him to have his handy, resourceful, and always needing/wanting something to do father-in-law have a worthwhile project to keep busy with by artistically cementing obsidian pieces to various exterior areas of their casa. Certainly Payno the half-moon conure and Yoshi the cockatiel would appreciate some large volcanic rocks to perch from. Think of how many obsidian related birthday gifts, anniversary presents, and Valentine�s Day keepsakes Lupita could be the grateful l (?) recipient of! Why, of course, all of that obsidian could be responsibly utilized and then some! As for all of that obsidian that he could not carry back from his first adventure in Zinaparo or that had still one fine day remained undiscovered by him in those, hopefully, accessible hills and mountains�

Yet, Wes knew that day was special and unique, his first wide-eyed and open-handed (bag-filling faster than fast) exposure, of what would certainly be more than many to that obsidian natural wonder paradise. Certainly, he had behaved like a kid in a (rock) candy store. However, he was fully confident and cognizant that he would learn to be more selective in the future. Just as he no longer would take the entire beach home with him when he went beachcombing, on future sojourns into Zinaparo he would be morethan satisfied with a couple or so obsidian collectables. Perhaps even, no make that more than likely, he would also in times to come, take hikes there just for the exercise, to enjoy the wildlife, to appreciate the array of multi-colored wild flowers, to further enhance his cow avoidance skills, and to ascend summits to gaze down upon the buena vistas without any intention of adding to his �never can be complete� collection. Knowing himself, he was aware that, although not feeling compelled to pick up and keep each and every piece (look at and admire maybe, though) he could never become jaded about obsidian nor about any of the other naturalistic opportunities of joy, wonder, miracles, and magic that Zinaparo had to offer.

Consequently, he realized that he would never have to return to Zinaparo. Any additional visits there would be like prized yet unexpected bonuses to be cherished and treasured (world class obsidian or not) but never hoarded or taken for granted. That initial visit there was a blessing in a here and now �what an amazing time immemorial world that we live in� non-religious yet spiritual way; by itself it could have been enough. Any further journeys there would result in him becoming become twice blessed, thrice blessed� Yet, he knew that such divine earthly providence was not an entitlement for himself or anyone else- except maybe for the seemingly ubiquitous cows, whether they appreciated it or not.

Then, seeing beyond Zinaparo, Wes reflected on where he was at. As incongruous as it may seem forthis �only gringo in town� outsider, he truly was, for the first time, home at last. In the materialistic minimalist environment that he had created for himself in of all places, Spanish speaking, social, time �no importa,� family-oriented, and past-conflicted/driven Mexico, this Type-A internally competitive and time urgency guy who more often than not could make Thoreau seem like a social butterfly, was, at long last, content. No longer would there be a desire for or a need for anymore 1,2,5,or 7 year plans. Talk about luxury! On a day-to-day basis, he could look forward to his present becoming his future. Never before had his beliefs and his actions so consistently become one and the same. To paraphrase Wordsworth (without all those darn Greek mythological allusions), Wes took non-materialistic comfort in knowing that �the world� need not �be too much with us� as we need not �lay waste our powers, getting and spending.� This time, without ending with negative exclamation points, positively �basta is basta and enough is enough,� he contentedly concluded.

Now if only that bus would make an appearance! Then, Wes could get back home and regale Lupita and Senor Esperanza with his no need to embellish Zinaparo stories. With no regrets, he could even tell them about �the big ones� that got away. Oh yes, after that he would wash, sort, and try to figure what to do with
all that obsidian! Did he have enough obsidian? Well, no and si! As he had discovered, like all material things in life, enough certainly was not bad at all!

My gosh! I never realized there were so many species of beetles. Have you ever seen one that hums loudly? In Fallon, Nevada my son and I saw a beetle that was quite large, about two inches long. Every time we got too close to it, it would hum very loudly. Son said it must be a "Hum Bug".

It was a dark grayish color with a little dark brown or black on it.

With so many beetles, it must be a divine plan of sorts - hmmmmm?