BellaOnline Forums Relationships Married No Kids What's up with all the baby-obsessed men? - Rant!!

VirgoGirl, don't get me wrong, my post was not at all meant to talk women married to wonderful men into giving up and having a child. You are 100% right, a child changes everything. I always wonder at people who think and even say out loud that children bring a couple together. It makes me wonder what kind of relationship they had before child. I don't care what people say, it is quite the opposite. Only a very strong relationship can survive such a burden: lack of intimacy, lack of freedom , lack of time. And if you want an orderly neat home with a toy-free living-room, well, constant stress to keep it like that. How can that bring together a couple that enjoys sex, dining out, meeting friends, traveling, staying in bed with a book or the newspaper Sunday mornings, I just wonder... But it cannot be denied that a lot of people, men and women alike, think it is worth it and make it work.
I used to think of people who wanted children as aliens. Really. I could not relate at all. I could not see the advantages, no matter how cute a kid of carrying, giving birth to one and then stress over it 24/7 for years. It seemed absolutely pointless to me. For survival reasons, I have learned that we, the vocational CFs, are the aliens. We are just different and have to learn to live with that. I was getting the vibe from some posts (in general, nothing concrete) that some people were implying that men who want children from their wives are being selfish and inconsiderate. But actually in our society that is considered the normal thing. Sad as it is, we are the odd-one outs who have to compromise, bring the relationship to an end or hope that our loved one will give up the baby idea.
I identify with you a lot, and I wish you the best for your marriage with all my heart.

I agree with you! I used to think that my MAIN reason for wanting a child was because it brings a couple even closer, the love is stronger, better, you share something magical that childfree couple don't...and then I started seeing around the sad reality. One male friend said to me a few years ago when he was getting divorced: "the worse was not to get married...it was to have children!" And then, almost 2 years ago, a male co-worker who was also getting divorced told me I was CRAZY to think that children bring a couple closer together. You have no idea how crushed I was to "learn" this. That's when I REALLY started the process of deciding to never have kids. I said, if my main reason is gone, and sadly it's quite the opposite, then what's there left?

I also understand the second part of the quote. When I mention to my husband how so and so is planning to have a baby, or that so and so eventually wants children, and I make a face like "whatever", he says: "yes, but don't judge them! THEY are the normal people, it's totally normal to want children! YOU are the one that doesn't follow the norm in this society." Like you said Solalux, we are the odd-one outs and sometimes I forget that. And in my case, although I wish it was different, and as upset as I might be that my husband doesn't share (for the moment) my opinion to be CF, I understand him and don't think he's selfish or inconsiderate. If anything, I'm the one. I totally admire him for accepting my change of heart and respecting my decision.

Hi Solalux! Respect- I know because of what you have put yourself through for your marriage and your feelings about it that you were not trying to talk anyone into anything. I hope you didn't think I was testy. Interestingly, I've been speaking to women and men about this very thing. When I try to nail them down on WHY they had kids, or if they wanted to, I can't get definite answers. Here are some answers I've gotten from close friends and family of all ages: "I was never interested in having kids, but I'm really glad I had my daughter. I hope you decide to do it." "I never thought about whether or not I wanted to, I just wanted my life to look like everybody else's." "My father died that year, and I really needed a distraction." Notice that these people I spoke to never said they wanted kids because they WANTED them. If they are the normal ones, then they must do it without too much self-examination, because there seem to be alot of people who just go ahead and DO this, and are shocked at how difficult it is. Naomi Wolf says that mothers are not born, they are forged out of a kind of necessity. She and her friends found themselves changing because they had to. The baby became the most important thing over their husbands, they gave up work and a lot of their sex life, and became more distant from their husbands to become an authoritarian, strong life force, which is great. I have a healthy respect for what that takes, because the alternative is to be a lousy mother. But I'm sure I don't want a baby enough to change into a woman like that. I want an equal partnership with my DH, and I want a good figure (in my biz you have to look good if you're going to perform), a strong career, time and money to do what I'd like. Maybe I am the alien, but perhaps only because many people who do choose the kid route do it without thinking about what the price truly is. Present company excluded. :)

Besides my husband I know of one other guy who had an important male figure die in his family, and that is what prompted the crisis to want to have children "now". I don't understand this reasoning.

I also do believe that my husband wants his life to look like everyone else's, especially his old school friends and co-workers. He feels that he is missing out on something that these people have achieved. I get the impression that when asked if he has children by others who already have a family, he feels like a failure for not having accomplished this goal in his life by now.

My husband looks for approval from other people due to his bad childhood and his immaturity. I know he doesn't feel like he has his parents' approval, so his friends will have to do. They can be very influencial in his life, more so than myself these days. It's too bad he couldn't just accept my approval of him and be happy that he had so much already that was good in his life.

this one kills me, and I heard it a number of times. You ask why and they come up with the "before" and the "after" situation and nothing from the "in between", namely the decision-making process. I guess for a lot of people it is very difficult to admit thay did it for peer pressure, to be like everybody else, because they felt guilty...

It's been awhile since I last visited this forum. For anyone who remembers me, I am a married mother of one daughter, almost 4 years old. I don't have much time to look at all the posts on this topic. As far as men "obsessed with babies"...hmm, depends on why the want one. If they really are feeling the urge to love and guide another human being from birth (or adoption) to adulthood, I see nothing wrong with this. The problem is, I think some of these men see babies as accessories, or "keeping up with the Joneses". A guy on one forum told his wife WITH A TUBAL LIGATION it would be O K if she came home pregnant. Umm,,,ooookaayyy. I know men who are closer to the 40 and 50 end of age than 30, with major health problems, wanting babies. And really, I think the men want wives and babies more than they want to be husbands and fathers, which is wrong. I think before getting married states should ask if the couple to be plans on having any kids or no. To those who reply 'no', they should be asked how they plan to go about NOT doing this. Those who are needing some guidance on birth control/sterilization could maybe get it. Those who want one or more kids should have to sit through a class where they ask themselves why they want kid(s)? Do they want babies or do they want to love and guide through the stages of development? Do they want to have kid(s) or be parents? How do they see a child changing their lives? What are they willing to sacrifice of themselves, their time, their financial resources for a child or children? That is one thing that baffles me about this forum. How do so many women who don't want kids marry men who do? Isn't this unfair to both parties? Did someone just assume the other would change his or her mind? Shouldn't an agreement be reached BEFORE the marriage, or the engagement be broken? My husband and I agreed to have no more than 2 kids before we married, and we have agreed to stick with the one. I have seen my share of guys either 1) divorce on this issue, 2) end up with one or more kids they didn't want giving in to the wife, 3) one of my guy friend's ex-wife "freaked out" when he told her he only wanted one child. He had had kids in previous marriages, and ex turned out to be neglectful of the one, where he now has custody. I am not seeing how two people could marry with such different points of view on such a critical issue.

[quote=spacecase]That is one thing that baffles me about this forum. How do so many women who don't want kids marry men who do? Isn't this unfair to both parties? Did someone just assume the other would change his or her mind? Shouldn't an agreement be reached BEFORE the marriage, or the engagement be broken? My husband and I agreed to have no more than 2 kids before we married, and we have agreed to stick with the one. I have seen my share of guys either 1) divorce on this issue, 2) end up with one or more kids they didn't want giving in to the wife, 3) one of my guy friend's ex-wife "freaked out" when he told her he only wanted one child. He had had kids in previous marriages, and ex turned out to be neglectful of the one, where he now has custody. I am not seeing how two people could marry with such different points of view on such a critical issue. [/quote] People can and do change their hearts and minds. It happens, and isn't something that they should feel bad about.

Hi spacecase- My husband and I talked about this before we got married- I told him I didn't want kids. At the time, it was OK with him. Now it's not. I suspect he either wasn't in touch with his feelings enough to know he really wanted them, or it really was OK at the time. We are close and do talk alot about many things, so I don't think he was lying or withholding anything. To all- I'm in the middle of "I'm OK, You're a Brat." Wow! A good read, for parents, people on the fence, and CFers. Check it out!

My husband and I both wanted kids when we got married. I changed my mind due to many reasons....and he was so immature that it scared me to think of having kids with him. He took a very long time to grow up and still has a way to go after 16 yrs. If he had matured earlier we may have had a couple of kids together. It just was not the right situation for me, and he never showed me a strong, responsible man within himself wanting to be a father.

I raised HIM already.

There are a lot of ideas that are still prevalent in our society about what a woman 'should' want and how we 'should' be naturally. Because of this, I think that some men don't really think of bearing children and raising them as a sacrifice on the woman's part. Because, you know, we're wired to want to do it more than anything else in the whole world. It isn't a sacrifice, it's a sacred calling that we ALL can't wait to fulfill!! I remember being so frustrated when I was dating. I remember a man I was very attracted to calling me up to ask me out. Then he started asking me about kids. I was very honest about it. I said something to the effect of 'no way, why would I want to have kids?' The conversation became him trying to convince me that I would be such a wonderful mother, and that I'd Loove it once I gave it a shot, and that kids were so important to him. Needless to say, we didn't go out on that first date. Another man I'd been on one date with called me drunk one night and started asking me if I would have his child. I said 'no!' First, because I didn't know him well enough to decide if I even wanted to sleep with him, and second, because I really don't want kids. He started babbling about how beautiful motherhood is, and how it makes women so happy, and how he wants so many kids. I said "No kidding! It's so easy for you. All you have to do to create a child is have an orgasm during intercourse. You don't have to go through labor, or pregnancy, or clean up poop and puke, etc, etc." Then I hung up on him and stopped seeing him. Funny, he was thinking babies, and at the time, he didn't have a job or any sort of stable income to support a child. Speaking of just wanting to spread the genes around, right. I do think that, overwhelmingly, men don't realize quite the impact that children have on a woman's life. But I agree that it's usually cluelessness, and not hateful reasons. They are a product of a culture that has conditioned us to believe that all women have the urge to be mothers, and that a woman who doesn't is 'unnatural.' Sometimes it probably is to keep a woman 'in her place.' But I don't believe that's usually the case. I really feel for people who are in marriages in which one partner changes their mind about kids. There's really not much compromise possible on that issue. Actually, my husband's first marriage fell apart in part because of that. His ex wife wanted kids and he didn't. There were plenty of other issues at work, but that was a big reason for the end of the marriage. As he put it, he wanted her to be happy, and since he wasn't able to give her what she wanted, he had to say goodbye. It was sad. They were together for 12 years, and it's hard to walk away from a marriage. Now, she's with a new partner, and they have a child together. He met and married me, and everyone is happy. He got a vasectomy about a month after we got married. Funny, the doctor who performed the vasectomy told him that he was jealous of us for our decision not to have kids. He said something about women wanting kids a lot of the time, and how nice it was for my husband that I didn't want them.