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Joined: Feb 2004
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Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
I think I mentioned this before but here's an update from Peggy on the United Airlines situation. On a related noted, the Canadian courts decided it was discriminatory for a Canadian airline to do this. United Airlines� Plans Discriminate Against People of SizeFor Immediate Release: April 17, 2009 Oakland, CA - NAAFA, a civil rights organization working to end discrimination against people of size strongly urges United Airlines to reconsider their new discriminatory policy of charging passengers of size for two seats. United Airlines has stated that they have implemented this policy as a result of receiving 700 complaints last year, which is equal to 1/1000th of 1% of the passengers traveling on their airline. (63,000,000 passengers traveled United in the same period) A significant policy change based on such a minute percentage is more obviously a new attempt at getting more money out of the consumer�s pocket than any concern for their well-being. Tall, short, thin or fat, broad shoulders, wide hips or longer legs�people come in all sizes and it is rare for any coach seat to provide a comfortable and pleasant travel experience. The responsibility of serving customers of all sizes is the cost of doing business in today�s modern world and that cost should not come at the expense of any one group of individuals. NAAFA believes United�s policy change will add yet another way to discriminate against already marginalized fat people and be counter productive to United�s and the airline industry�s economic future. Should United insist on enforcing this policy, NAAFA recommends that people of size seek out and travel airlines that do not have such discriminatory policies. Founded in 1969, NAAFA is a non-profit civil rights organization dedicated to improving the quality of life for fat people. NAAFA works to eliminate discrimination based on body size and provide fat people with the tools for self-empowerment through public education, advocacy, and member support. On the web: www.naafa.org For more information contact: Peggy Howell, Public Relations Director, NAAFA email: naafa_pr[at}yahoo.com phone: (707)246-6116
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 437
Gecko
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Gecko
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 437 |
Okay, let me begin by saying that I am not that skinny - I'm a size 18. I also fly a fair amount and I have been seated in a row of three with a woman who easily took up 2 seats. Because she wasn't charged for 2 - and therefore assigned 2 - all 3 of us were uncomfortable for the entire flight. I think it shouldn't be arbitrary but something along the lines of "if you are bigger than X, you won't fit in our seats." I don't know. I can see why it can be considered discrimination, but if you don't fit in the seat, you don't fit in the seat. It's not fair to have your seatmates be scrunched, either. I *know* that airlines *should* make the seats bigger, but they don't, so we have to try to make the best of what we have. Also, just because such a small number complained doesn't mean that more haven't had bad experiences. I didn't complain, for example. It's hard.
Barbara Sharpe
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
You kind of said it right there: "airlines *should* make the seats bigger, but they don't". That is the problem right there. Our society has grown bigger so the airlines need to adjust to their CUSTOMERS.
I don't think that slimmer customers should be squished into a seat between two larger people or however. But the airlines need to make accommodations for all types of customers and they shouldn't be penalizing their bigger client�le.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398
Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
We been brainwashed into accepting that we must "try to make the best of what we have".
If we were really doing that then there wouldn't be an extra charge, the seat would be made available.
If someone is too tall and their legs impose on the leg room of my seat, I wouldn't expect them to have to pay for another seat so he can stretch out. I would expect the airline to move them to the front to the front so they have more leg room or where there are two empty seats so he can shift his legs better.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,025
BellaOnline Editor Elephant
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BellaOnline Editor Elephant
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,025 |
Maybe that's an idea. If the airlines aren't able or going to make seats bigger, there should be an area, like you mention up front where you can stretch out. There could be not so much the charge for two seats but a bit extra and once those sold out, they sold out.
I have to admit, I'm living in a day in age where people complain or file law suits and get their way. I am much more apt to go without or make due. I didn't think of it as brain washing but maybe it is. I had just thought of it as consideration for others. I can also attest, though that I'm the last person to be accomodated, so, lol, it really is a catch 22.
I'm a size 6-8, but I'm not charged less. I can also affirm that even the seats I fly in are cramped so it's got to be uncomfortable for larger or taller individuals. I think every one would like bigger seats.
It would be interesting possibly, though I doubt this will ever happen, to have adjustable (safe-lock) seats. It would require a revamping of the entire structure though.
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Elleise
Clairvoyance Editor
Last edited by Eleise - Clairvoyance; 04/19/09 05:11 PM.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398
Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
Thanks Eleise. For a size 6-8 to feel cramped then there definitely is a problem with seat size. There has to be a seat adjustment for the society we live in now. According to stats the majority of women are size 12 - 14. So that should be the minimum seat size.
Bigger seats for everyone! LOL
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398
Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
Fat Blogger and author Kate Harding has a great post about United's new "Fatties Pay More policy" on her blog. The post and the comments are worth reading.
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Posts: 229
Shark
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Shark
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 229 |
I'm going to stir the pot a little here. I'm a frequent flyer, and have had to give up half my seat to the person next to me many times. And yes, it makes me really mad. I paid for a single seat, I take up the space of a single seat, why is it that the person next to me, who also paid for a single seat, gets to take up more than s/he paid for? It's a simple real estate question. You get what you pay for. If you need more space, you pay for more space. Just like if you need to carry more baggage than the baggage allowance, you pay more for the extra baggage.
I don't see how it is discrimination to make people pay for what they use. In fact, I think it is very unfair that the only way I can almost guarantee that I actually get to use the seat I paid for is to buy a first-class ticket - why is it that I am the one who has to pay more when I am not the one taking up more space?
The regulations that United has put in place are not particularly draconian. Not being able to get the armrest down means that you are taking up your neighbor's seat, plain and simple. It's not about making life difficult for people who are large, it's about making sure that everyone gets what they paid for: not less, and not more.
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Gecko
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Gecko
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 437 |
Fat Blogger and author Kate Harding has a great post about United's new "Fatties Pay More policy" on her blog. The post and the comments are worth reading. I actually *completely* disagree with her. I have no expectation that my seatmates will be "delightful" or even friendly. I also don't have the expectation that I won't touch anyone. I could care less if someone is touching me. I do, however, have the expectation that I will be able to sit in my seat and not have to share a good part of my seat with someone who doesn't fit into his/hers. I realize it doesn't happen that frequently but the fact remains that it does. And, if it doesn't happen that frequently (as the Fat Blogger suggests) then why is she worried about this policy? It won't affect that many people, right?
Barbara Sharpe
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Tiger
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Tiger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,398 |
I realize it doesn't happen that frequently but the fact remains that it does. And, if it doesn't happen that frequently (as the Fat Blogger suggests) then why is she worried about this policy? It won't affect that many people, right? Because it is discriminatory! Our society has grown bigger so the airlines need to adjust to their CUSTOMERS as a whole. All their customers. Besides who gets to decide if a person must pay more and when does it get decided? (that's a rhetorical question) Ok, lets look at something from another view, and I'm only bringing this up because you're the gay/lesbian editor. I'm not saying this because I believe it I'm saying it because some people may believe it and am hoping to make you understand what we're saying from a different perspective: Many gay/lesbians want the right to get married. But really, in relation to the population at large there isn't that many so why worry about it, it doesn't affect that many people so there is no reason to allow them to get married. See how that just doesn't work. It's wrong to impose something because "it won't affect that many people". Fat people don't want to be uncomfortable and they don't want to make the people beside them uncomfortable. They are protesting the increase in money to one section of society based on size. It is discriminating. They are not saying skinny people need to put up and shut up. The airlines need to change with the times. Did you read the whole post. There were excellent points in there. And I think many of the comments really make sense.
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