BellaOnline Forums Education Gifted Education student rejected by Ivies, despite stellar record

First, part of the reason the top schools are admitting so few students compared to the number of applications is that they are all a [censored] shoot and few applicants are bound and determined to attend only one school (as our son has been) so cast a wide net to try to improve their odds. People with a perfect SAT score an a high GPA who want to attend a state U other than a top tier state U like Berkeley don't really need to apply anywhere else, and people who are applying to lower ranked schools just don't have the same need in general to do mass applications. I think it was fairly rare for applicants to apply to 10+ schools twenty years ago where now it is fairly common and so that drives up the low acceptance rate right there.

Which isn't to say things aren't more competitive as they are due to more people applying to college and every year, top students raising the bar by doing more and more to stand out from the crowd. Thirty years ago, only about a dozen people a year got a perfect SAT, so that was all you needed if your GPA was also good. Now, there are so many perfect SAT scorers that I suspect a larger percentage of applicants with the perfect score get rejected than the just below perfect score as colleges love to brag "We had to reject X number of perfect SAT scores this year" and they never brag "We had to reject X number of 2390 SAT scores this year." I suspect students are shooting themselves in the face at times with the perfect score (or maybe just the foot). Having a perfect score can also give some people the impression that the applicant has a perfectionist streak that could cause burn out or suicide or whatever down the road, be it true or false, the impression itself can hurt.

Second, anyone who thinks homeschooling is going to be a hook is indeed wrong, though it could help somewhat if admissions people are aware of how homeschooled students have a higher college GPA than other students and the lowest drop out rate from college (I've heard it was zero, but suspect a homeschooler somewhere has dropped out of college by now; it is suspected to be low as homeschoolers tend not to go to college if they don't truly want to be there, where private schooled and public schooled children who go to college are more likely than homeschoolers to have been pressured by parents to attend). My guess is most admissions people might still be unaware of these things, though, where some might know they tend to be good self-starters and such.

However, any homeshooler will be judged against other homeschoolers just as any student from one high school is judged against others at the same high school, and homeschoolers arean impressive bunch on the whole. We attended a talent night for art student scholarships (where drama, opera, music, etc. was included under "art") and there was only one homeschooler in the 10 finalists and he won the top grant of $5K. Over and over again, it seems homeschoolers take prizes in whatever they compete in, and if the homeschooler hasn't won any awards, they best have done some other unusual stuff as admissions people know they didn't have to do as much 'homework' as someone attending a regular school nor waste time getting to and from school or in lines for lunch, the bathroom, etc.

I think the one advantage many homeschoolers (though not all by any means!) have is that they often learn things because they want to -- which his a huge boost in success. We all put more energy into things we feel strongly about.

They also have less wasted time than the traditionally schooled students as a whole (though I've seen one homeschooled student who was a past master at wasting time, sigh) which frees up more time to pursue actual interests, something that many colleges like to see.

Good point about the "almost perfect" SAT's, too -- kind of like bragging, "We're #2, we're #2!"

It seems like "getting in" is mainly a problem for kids fresh out of high school. Our kids opted to spend a few years pursuing other goals after finishing homeschool. One applied to college when she was 21, and the other when she was 22. Both kids had excellent ACT scores and some interesting experiences to mention on their applications by the time they applied to their colleges. They both ended up with nearly full scholarships. One has graduated with honors, and the other has maintained a 4.0 for two years and has two more years to go. I'm not bragging, I'm just saying that, in our experience, it looks like competition starts to be less of a factor as applicants get older; AND students seem to get serious as they get older.

One thing that made me think this would work for our kids was that, over the years, I noticed local colleges competing aggressively for older students seeking 4 year degrees. When my kids expressed the desire NOT to go straight to college, I kept in mind that older people seemed to be sought after by colleges. It gave me peace of mind waiting to see if my kids would ultimately try college. Something else that put me at ease with this approach was a statistic I heard from a college president. He said that a large percentage of college freshmen do not finish college. I do not remember the exact percentage, but I think it was in the neighborhood of 50%. Doesn't it seem like there's a huge possibility that many 18 year olds just do not know what they want to do? Maybe it's normal not to be certain about what to study when you're still so inexperienced.

For us, this "late" approach worked. I'd love to know if anyone else has had a similar experience.

My dad always says that when he started UCONN (back in the 60s) that they had the entire freshman class in a big auditorium. They told them to look right - and to look left - and that at least one of those people would be gone by the end of the year. I remember something similar at WPI. Of course I only lasted the one year at WPI so I guess that someone was me

Yes I definitely think that taking a year or two off to work will make it more clear to teens the great benefit they're getting in college. After being "forced" to go to school for 12 years straight, many teens look at school as a chore. They don't realize the huge benefits of college.

My nephew is having to pay his own way through college and even had to take a semester off to earn more money. I am helping him out financially to keep him on track but he really is *much* more appreciative of his education than his friends are. He knows exactly what it's worth and is determined to do well at it to then graduate and get the job he wants.

Here's a stat -

"Just 54 percent of students entering four-year colleges in 1997 had a degree six years later � and even fewer Hispanics and blacks did, according to some of the latest government figures. After borrowing for school but failing to graduate, many of those students may be worse off than if they had never attended college at all."

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Cela-

You raise an important point. Kids who take a "gap year" or a few of them, as your children did, often return to formal academics with a more serious attitude and a better idea of WHAT they are working toward. These years can give the later applicants valuable experiences that make them extremely attractive to colleges. If good SAT scores and GPAs are a dime a dozen, a kid who spent a year working in a different culture or running their own business might be seen as a great asset to a college.

Lisa-

Your stats are scary!

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"Today, at least 57 percent of undergraduates are 21 or older."

Well, but aren't they always?? I turned 18 my freshman year of college but I was a year behind. Most of my friends turned 18 in high school. That means they turn 19 freshman year, 20 sophomore year, and 21 junior year ...

On the cynical side, I wonder if colleges don't just tolerate the huge freshman classes because it's guaranteed income. Call me crazy, but parents would do well not to mandate immediate college attendance when their kids graduate from high school--for several reasons. Forget about why we expect 18 year olds to be certain of a career track--dorm life alone is enough to make one wonder why the blank we rush to pile a bunch of 18 year olds in the same place all at the same time.

We're always encouraging people to think outside the box and to be independent thinkers, but we act like lemmings about the hoops we put out kids through.

When I applied to school, I applied to 27 different ones all over the country. However, the majority were in-state where I would get better deals on tuition and so forth.

I was accepted to all 27 universities and I had to narrow it down. I narrowed it to 4 different schools and notified the others that I would not be attending there and if I decided in the future I wanted to attend, I would reapply. I was lucky because I did early acceptance and was able to have the time to narrow it down. I also didn't have to pay an application fee since I was poor and they gave me waivers.

I was encouraged to apply to 5-10 schools as back then (in 95) there were so many openings. My niece is now going to be a senior in HS and she was told to only apply to 5 or less.