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"Surely it's about building up the power base of the religion...more power in numbers"

Probably, as I think it is in some other religions, I don't even like it when people say we have to have babies or we'll be over-run with Muslims! Actually, I find it quite offensive, being that I'm married to a Muslim and a lovely, peaceful one at that! However, being that our kids would have a Muslim father, those sort of people wouldn't really want our kind of child anyway! But I hate the assumption that everyone marries someone of their own race, religion etc. cos that's not always true!

I cringe when I hear this "Surely it's about building up the power base of the religion...more power in numbers"

I believe it is probably true but the reason I cringe is cos I think to the people who do this you CANNOT guarantee WHAT beliefs your child will grow up with! I am an EX Christian who is now into a bit of magick (witch craft, but nothing too OTT!) and New Thought (creating your own reality.) etc.
And Neuro-linguistic programming too. And Mandalas. BUT
I am NOT a Christian any more. I now no longer believe in the Bible, Bible-God, Jesus OR the Holy Spirit. I do not go to church and never want to again, I do not pray to God/Jesus and I do not even believe in Hell.
And yet I was raised to believe in ALL that stuff!

And one of the other forums I go on is a forum for ex Christians who are no longer believers and 99% of them were ALSO born into Christian homes and raised by Christian parents and brought up in the religion and yet - like me - they chose to turn their backs on it.

I have also heard there is a forum for ex-Muslims and I bet you that at least SOME of their members would have been raised in Islam!

I don't know for sure but I bet that somewhere out there, there are ex Buddists, Hindus, Wiccans and so on, and yes we know of people who were raised Atheist and as adults adopted a religion. I know a girl raised by Atheist parents who chose to become a Muslim as an adult because she believed it was true.

And I work with an ex Jew. Well OK he is still Jewish of course by blood, Israeli etc. But he does NOT go to Synagogue, eat Kosher or believe in Judaism. Even though he was brought up in it.

Marilyn Manson was raised as a Christian, did you know?

So there is NO guarantee that just because you raise your kids religious that they will continue in "the faith"

Which is why I think having children to increase the numbers of your religion is really REALLY STUPID!
(And kinda prejudice too!)

(P.S. it's another reason I don't want kids, hubby - or if not him, then his family - would want them raised Muslim, my parents and family would want them raised Christian, I would want the child to either be into New thought or else explore religions, spirituality, atheism and agnosticism and make up their OWN mind and I KNOW that ONE of us would HAVE to therefore be disappointed!!!
Plus while I respect the beliefs of my husband and his family and I also respect my family's Christian beliefs, I know I would NOT be happy about my child being raised up in ANY religion, because of my experiences!
SO GLAD I DO NOT HAVE TO DEAL WITH THAT!!!

And so was I, but I had the 'advantage' of my parents, because of their differing religious backgrounds, delaying my religious upbringing, till I was 7 or 8. Too late, as by that time, I had already developed my logical mindset, so I started questioning pretty much from the beginning. I still went through the motions for the next 8-9 years.

The one "reason" that really upsets me most, as to why people should have children according to their $deity, is so that they can spread the word for future generations. People really can't shape how non-family members feel about religion (except by example) but by $deity, they can and will control how THEIR CHILDREN are brainw--err, religiously programmed.

Why do some of the more rebellious children (with respect to religion, morality, etc) are the children of MINISTERS, PASTORS, and those "really" religious people who have religion crammed down their throats from birth? If anyone should have such a "guarantee" for conformity, it should be them.

But yes, the religious "orientation" of a child can, in some families, as much, or more, divisiveness or separation between a parent and a child, than the child being gay. A child "leaving their religion" or totally not believing/worshipping $deity means that their "immortal soul" is lost, and that the child and the parent will not be reuninted in heaven. I've heard the religious talk shows and heard the sobs and tears of the mothers whose children are "damned to hell" because they are not of the fold. Thinking back to those people -- sheesh.

Religious Orientation of a child...I call that brainwashing at least it was in the church I was raised in.

My Father was a minister, he believed that if I was not fully committed to his religion that HE would not be saved because he had not done his job in brain washing me.

My Father used to speak of man had to be sent to the earth in the beginning and given a choice to follow God or not. I asked him if choice was so important then why is it that people brain wash their children removing their choice.

I no longer celebrate religion at all. Its not like I have found one that makes more sense then the one I was raised with. I was inundated with relgion and don't want to her about it anymore, EVER.

The other day I was explaining something about the Mutiny on the Bounty to my daughter and how the survivors ended up on an island which is now filled completely with Seventh Dat Adventists (the religion I was brained washed in as a child), I have done such a good job removing those hated words from our life that she actually asked me, "what is a Seventh Day Adventist?"

I'm not making any statements on whether anyone should or should not have children. I think that is up to the individuals concerned.

But having that number of children really doesn't mean that the children will have a poor quality of life. I have a friend (of a different belief system than mine) who had 9 children and has almost 100 grandchildren (the number just escaped my mind. )
I have not seen any happier children and definately any happier grandmother. All are loved and well cared for. Easter Baskets are put together by grandma and her daughters in a production line with the individual kids in mind.

I think that quality of life is a personal thing. A parent will choose to take very good care of a child or very poor care. It doesn't matter what the number of children is. 1 or 99 - it rests in the parent.

I just thought maybe I should jump in with a few quick facts. "Mormons" do not practice polygamy. In fact, it was dropped as a practice back in the 1800s, before Utah was even made a state. People who pratice polygamy are not practicing the Mormon faith and are excommunicated from the church.

Also, LDS women are not only to be "brood mares." I know plenty of LDS women who have only 1 or 2 children and work full-time jobs. I only have 1 daughter and I am a writer. We even use birth control.

My mom works full-time, as did her mom, and all three of my sisters. We are not alone in this. In fact, women are honored as mothers because without them no one else could be born. It is not something you are forced into. In fact, many women are still single and childless in the LDS church and they are not treated any differently than their married counterparts.

I agree with Lisa though, the quality of life children recieve has nothing to do with the number of children, but the parents themselves.

We do not have children to "keep the church going." There are over 13 million members world-wide, and the majority of new members each year come from new births, but there are thousands and thousands of baptisms each year of people who were not born to Mormon parents, but investigated and chose to become of member of the church.

I know that there are a lot of questions and a lot of misconceptions out there. I believe that most of these come from people who hear things and they get kind of turned around (remember that game "telephone" where you whisper to one person and it goes around the circle?).

I think the best thing each of us can do is to not take everything at face value, but do a little research and find out the truth. Knowledge is power.

I just wanted to try to clear up a few things that I read on here so that maybe we could all understand a little better.

I attended a Sunday school until I was 17 - I question everything in life, that's me - perhaps I think about things too much. I asked questions, I challenged, I disagreed...it was not appreciated - I was told that I just had to believe, have faith. I couldn't.....so I left the church. I sat on the fence for many years but now admit to being an atheist.
I have found religion often divides, judges, is hypocritical, sexist and sometimes even rascist - not all religions but some....
I don't want to be part of that.....
I work in Japan and have been exposed to the Buddhist way of thinking - I have been impressed by the gentle and non judgemental way of thinking - they also believe that to better yourself you look to yourself not to a God or anywhere else - the answers lie within you...I really respect that way of thinking. I also love to visit the temples - they have temples dedicated to unborn babies (many Japanese women have had abortions)children, animals - you can burn some incense, ring a bell and light a candle...really beautiful and soothing rituals.
When my cat died a few years ago - I attended a temple dedicated to pets and did those things for him (and for me) - it was very comforting...

Well, I have studied up on the Mormons, but there are other religions that are similar when it comes to this. The catholic church looks down upon birth control. I've always thought the reason for this is because they want that money to keep flowing into the church. Did you know the Mormons have more money then you ever thought possible???? It's amazing how much money they have. I think they are the wealthiest church out there. HOW? well, they keep having more kids to grow up who give money. The same as the catholics. I have nothing against religion by the way. I just read up on a lot of them. And, I believe in God *(just a side note).

Wealthiest churgh in the US...yes cited at just over 30 million according to google...richest in the world..not a fat chance. Google also states that Catholicism currently holds over a billion in assets.

Skeeter

I don't know about the rest of you but I find that kind of power in the hands of churches kind of worrying. In my opinion, you have to be easily led to buy into what these people do, the people who brain wash the participants have enormous power.