BellaOnline Forums Relationships Married No Kids Miscellaneous Ranting (caution, long and bitc#y)

No one should have to live on that little...call me stupid but maybe people should evaluate what their financial situation is BEFORE they bring children into this world. Or as Judge Judy says, get a second job. This is about responsibility, people shouldn't be able to bring children into this world and then not take responsibility for them, in a civilized community, we have the court system to make sure Fathers pay child support. Then we have the Fathers who do all they can to dodge it even with the court system breathing down their neck. How many women have you known that feel their man is a catch even though he doesn't pay child support for his children, they betray their own sex in doing this.

Any man with so little integrity would not get 5 minutes of my time once I knew this about him.

Sorry you are wrong about that, it is the system itself that is the problem. I can tell by your post that you are not really happy about your situation. Men are up for the job, and there are alot of men (like my husband) who step up to the plate and gladly calls both of my sons his own, even though they are not biologically his, don't leave them out of your statistics. And Women also take on the roll of Mom even when it isn't their biological child. I could tell you the true story involving my youngest son and the court systems, which would probably make your hair stand on end. It was all because of the judge but I stuck to my guns so to speak and yes I almost did serve time for contempt of court. I think we have to help each other, I had so much help (strangers, neighbors, etc.) that I am overly thankful for and because of that I give back every single chance I get. I don't blame anyone for my children, even when they are brats I still feel lucky to have them.

But people do live little, and even less, all over the world. We just didn't buy huge TVs, we didn't eat out every week, we didn't live beyond our means. I never realized that we had very little money. I never went hungry, I had good clothes. My mom did a good job of raising me. We weren't poor, but most of the money that my mom made went to paying off the house and the car. She never had money on credit cards.

So we didn't need that $30 a week.

Living on little money isn't that hard. We don't have very much money now. We watch our friends buy huge TVs and new couches and we can't afford it. We saved and saved to spend $1000 on a new hardwood floor that we're going to install ourselves (with my dad's help.)

We just stick to a budget and don't buy what we don't need.

Yes, people SHOULD evaluate their financial situation before they have kids. Situations change, though. Being a single mom you should know that. What happens if you lose your job?

My mom was able to afford me because she had a good, steady job as a teacher, so she had tenure. My dad is (generally) a good guy who ended up having some problems. Yeah, he wasn't the best dad, but he straightened his life out eventually. If she couldn't afford kids, she wouldn't have had me. Yeah, my dad probably shouldn't have had kids, but he did, and he is finally learning how to be a good dad.

Wow, this whole thread has taken off. I haven't had a chance to read everything yet. But I do agree with this statement. I think parents should do what they can to care for their children. But life isn't perfect, and things happen, and sometimes people need help. And things like health and education aren't negotiable, in my mind. I know a lot of kids that are born into tough situations, and it isn't their fault. I know some people argue, they aren't my kids, why should I care. I just think it's better for all of society if all people have food, medicine and hopefully education. If I'm paying for some of that, that's okay.

Sadly, even food, medicine and education isn't enough. Some kids are born into awful home situations, and aren't wanted. And no amount of food, medicine and education will make up for that. I'm not saying devnstep is like this, I'm just making a point, and it's just my opinion.

As a man, I agree any man should be willing to step forward and do his duty for any child he sired. However, whether some people here want to admit it or not, there are alot of women who take advantage of that and even the courts do as well.

My experience comes from working closely with a buddy of mine in Colorado with his custody battle. I know things vary state to state. However, in Colorado it is very anti-father.

First of all, the woman isn't required to work for the first 2 years of the child's life. The father is responsible for footing the bill during that time for both child and mother. The amount paid is also determined by your income POTENTIAL, not by what you are currently making. They take the previous year's earnings and look at the highest quarter and plug that number into their little equation. So if you happen to have changed to a lower paying job, or have a job which is commission based..you're screwed if you had 3 good months back-to-back. They look at that and say that is what you are capable of earning and therefore your support will be based off that.

My particular friend's ex ran off while pregnant(and not because of anything he did, she just liked to sleep around). Apparently after she gave birth to his kid, she had another one 11 months later. During this whole time she was living off the state on the TANF program getting all her bills payed for, daycare, and they were even paying for her to get her GED. They gave her cash which she spent on things like partying and cigarettes. He never got to see the kid(it was a daughter) for the first time until she was about 18 months old when the state had gone after him for child support. He had tried to offer assistance during the pregnancy and it was denied because the mother was afraid he would try to take custody of the kid. She and her mother even forbid him to see the child after she was born until he paid for a paternity test proving she was his.(like I said, she slept around) He couldn't afford that at the time. His ex then up and disappeared until the state went after him. A DNA test did indeed confirm the girl was his.

At that point, he went to court to contest the child support as he wasn't a dead beat dad, he had tried to be there, and even had a letter from the mother telling him that she didn't want him having anything to do with their daughter. In court she admitted all that(I was there for that) and the judge said that while by the spirit of the law he did what he should, by the letter he still had to pay. At this point it was like $6000. That day in court he got to see his daughter for the first time and the mother asked him to be involved because she was having a rough time raising two kids alone.

From there he was paying child support and doing visits. A couple of months later, the ex got both kids taken away from her for neglect. He tried to get custody but was denied. Social services had said at the time it was because he was too new in the picture. They would later go on to say they don't think single fathers made good parents. They also lied in court and resulted to smear campaigns to keep the child in foster care. My buddy eventually overcame all that and won custody of his daughter, and the mother had her parental rights forcibly taken away. And after all that, the state STILL wants him to pay off the $6000 back child support. It's not going to either the mother or child, just straight into the state's pocket. So now he has to be a single parent, with no child support(because ex doesn't have to pay since she no longer has rights), AND pay back child support.

The prejudice against males and fathers has gotten so out of hand in Colorado that there are actual legal organizations popping up to assist and fight for father's rights. He never even got to participate in naming his daughter or seeing the first parts of her life and yet he has to pay for it. That's really unfair. There are support organizations too like Os Padres that offer parental training and support, mostly for fathers fighting for parental custody.

So for all the dead beat dads out there, there are guys like my buddy who have busted their butts to do the right thing and constantly get the shaft from the woman and the courts. And you can say it's his fault for having a kid, but it takes two to tango. And having a kid is not a free-for-all ticket for women to use men or courts and social services to be prejudice towards fathers.

Travis, the situation you outlined is horrible. And I have heard similar stories. That's great that your friend perservered, and ultimately got custody of his child. I think there seems to be a stereotype of mothers being like saints. And believe me, I know some that are just barely doing their part.

With that said, I have known TONS of single Moms that are doing it all, and most of them were married when they had their kids, and had more than one child. This one woman I used to work with came to work with unmatching socks sometimes b/c she was so frazzled with the craziness of her life. I guess every situation is different. But I have to say it's refreshing to hear a story about a guy that went out of his way to get his daughter. That's actually really touching.

Yea, we're screaming because the child support cost is too high. IT IS TOO HIGH. We're talking about man who is building his career in a technology field, has a degree and is a "white-collar" worker. If I was not contributing to the household income, he would be selling off the furniture to pay for groceries. Basically, he can't survive on his salary. And my income is such that I can only keep us afloat.

At this point, he has pretty much given up the dream of ever having custody (after years of going to court only to return with less in the pocket and not even mandated visitation). But we're going to fight to get the support lessened to a reasonable amount. Then we're going to spend the next ten years trying to improve our incomes so that we can not only maintain our own lives, but can save a significant amount for the kid. Why ten years? Because that's how long before the girl is at college age and we know her selfish, wasteful mother isn't saving a penny of the $716 per month we're sending her. WE are going to have to be prepared to help that child through college.

That woman has a decently paying full time job, no daycare expenses (when the girl isn't in school, she's with her grandmother until her mom gets home), a paid off home, and a FULL THIRD of her ex's income. She's still crying poor. She wastes money (mostly on clothes and restaurant/bar tabs). She doesn't save it for her child.

And here I sit, month after month, trying to find a better paying job (even though I really like the one I have) and trying to whittle down our expenses just a little more so that we can have a chance at financing things like car repairs or clothes that are not too threadbare to wear to work.

What is it that I'm too close to see?

From the mom side of things, it's not always a case of a girl just keeping her legs open.

I have a friend who just recently separated from her husband. She was married for like 12 years and had two daughters. She never foresaw a divorce. Even though she eventually felt the marriage was loveless, she continued on. That is until two months ago when she discovered her husband's very large porn stash and that he had a STD.

Now she is separated, working towards a divorce. There is a chance she may need to get some assistance sometime down the road. She has a business degree, but it can be difficult to raise two kids and work a professional job. She surely could not predict her husband's infidelity. So the whole "evaluate the financial situation" can't really apply in this situation. The good news is that he is a good dad and fill probably fulfill his child support obligations.

The point is not everything is black and white. Men aren't always evil. Single moms aren't always sluts. People who are on assistance aren't always deadbeats. It's hard to remember this though because it's always the ones who abuse the system, and the jerks that stick in our memory.

And I have to say I DESPISE the notion that women get into their head that just because they carry the child, they get to make all the decisions. In situations where the couple is not together or there is hostility, the woman thinks she gets to pick the name, and whether or not the father gets to see the child and everything else. They act like the guy gets no say. That really ticks me off.

If the guy is not detrimental to the child, then he should get to be a part of that child's life and the decisions involved. Regardless of the mother's personal feelings for him.

Same old story - the few bad eggs ruin it everybody else. And you're right in that nobody can predict what's going to happen down the road. If we all thought like that, nobody would ever do anything, let alone have children.