BellaOnline Forums Relationships Married No Kids Are women the victims or accomplices?

Hey people,

As my BF and I are looking into organizing our tropical wedding in my home country, I logged on to a brides forum for some reviews of photographers, wedding planners etc.

And guess what I found? THIS...This

This kind of mentality is so prevalent even in educated women. It makes me sad and angry.

If some men look at women as baby-machines...and older people do...why in this day and age, do we allow ourselves to be treated like our sole purpose is to make babies?

Notice that "FLUENE" got many replies and most of them are not challenging her views but to offer advice and help on how she can serve her purpose as the baby machine.

I am so glad my bf doesn't treat me like her husband. ARGH!

Ay, ay, ay....how depressing! This is the year 2007, for crying out loud!! Somehow I got the impression that this woman was educated, but talk about being programmed for something (baby-machine) since childhood! Now she can't even see herself as something else other than that, and the people that are supposed to be her support system bring her down even more. What is it to them? I have never understood that position. The people who put the most pressure on us about having kids are not going to be there for the diaper-changing sessions, the all-nighters when the child is sick, or the teenager does not come home, they are not going to contribute to the college-savings fund, they are not going to share the countless trips to soccer games, ballet practices, etc.., so...once again: why is it so important to them? what do they have to gain? It seems to me that this is more about validating their own choices, than about the person they are putting pressure on. Fluene's 'loved ones' should show some support for a change, and her husband should probably stand up for her in front of his family. Cultural issues might be a big part of it, though. I'm not sure. NAW, are you Malaysian? Is this typical?

If you read down in the replies, later she says this:

"Funny thing is, I don't even like kids. However, I strongly feel that having kids is a responsibility to be fulfilled whether one like it or not. If we have the financial security to ensure that we can provide for our kids (if we ever have any) when we are old and retired, then I will feel more at ease. But till then, I don't think I can just wipe all these thoughts out of my mind."

It sounds very old fashioned and strange, but really deep down it is very similar to what a lot of of us talk about. I don't like to admit to myself how much societal pressure about this there is even in our culture, though maybe it's expressed a little differently. In America (or western cultures) they say instead IDWIYO (It's different when it's your own) because they know we're "enlightened" not to sign on for 100% martyrdom.

Fascinating post...thanks for sharing it.

Hi Tiaali. I am Malaysian and she and I have the same race background. So in many ways I take this even closer to heart.

What upsets me is that this girl is confused. She has been brainwashed to believe her life's purpose is get married (to some obviously very traditional chinese jerk) and to have kids FOR him and FAMILIES. And what do the other girls reply? They confirm that stupid notion and help bring her down more.

I actually wrote to ask her to seek deep down and get to know herself to see if she truly finds happiness in motherhood.

My post was side-stepped right away by all the other response who "advises" her on how to become pregnant! Some even offered tips on going to pray and superstitions like rubbing a pregnant belly!

And mind you...most of these girls are educated. Fluene works in R&D.

This reminded me why I moved away to Denmark. Hm!

And by the way, it is to typical of my culture to teach girls to put their own happiness behind their husbands. And most girls are taught to choose husbands based on criteria women used umpteen years ago.

So truly, it is the women's inability to exercise our rights which create this kind of sad situation. Imagine...one year of marriage and her husband is asking her month after month if she have had her menstruation. And he refused to speak to her when her SIL gave birth. What does this speak of him?

What I observe here is ...low self esteem woman chose jerk husband. Very typical!

You are correct. If you don't procreate, it's like you don't value their procreation. This poor woman is in a bad place, b/c she married a sexist jerk. And the people that described her as a chicken without eggs. Seriously? I would like to say, I'm a human being, not a henhouse. And they are making fun of her for not being able to get pregnant? And the thing is, she IS trying. I am so glad I don't live there. I would want to slap everyone. I agree with Frieda that it's related to the bs we get here, but these people are so dated in their thinking.

It's a shame that she sees having kids as an obligation. I really feel for her. It's such a scam - people glorify marriage, but not even a year later, you are locked into having kids? Talk about the honeymoon being over (if you don't want kids). I would never get married if I lived in this type of community, if kids were an obligation. But I'm sure they aren't cool with women being single either. People just can't handle nontraditional lifestyles.

"Funny thing is, I don't even like kids. However, I strongly feel that having kids is a responsibility to be fulfilled whether one like it or not."

Oh my dear Lord! This is the wrong idea to have. But, a lot of my family members feel like that. I can still remember the reactions of most of them when I "came out" of the "childfree closet" (I told them that I did not and planned to not be a parent in any shape or form)...the horror, the horror....

I thought this growing up, but I knew I didn't want them. I wonder how many women feel this way? They probably get guilted into having them. Why would anyone sign up to do something they don't like for the rest of their life. I hate to compare childrearing to a job, but in some ways it's similar. I would never, ever, take a job as a lion tamer. It doesn't matter how popular lion taming becomes, how much it pays, or if everyone I know is doing it - it is something I REALLY don't want to do.
How could this woman marry this man knowing this is her fate!

Actually, it is very much due to upbringning and culture that she married this man.

I used to have nightmares as a girl when in the dream, I lived this life exactly! But where I come from. it is hard for girls to see beyond this. They're conditioned to think that it is a woman's role and it justifies their feminity. Men have their roles like providing financially. So the gender roles are still very traditional.
I always say to my BF that he should be glad he is not chinese. Otherwise I would just drive his parents up the wall and give them heart attacks with my thinking.

I dated a half Chinese guy once. (In fact he was my first you know what, sometimes I think WHY HIM but he WAS gorgeous, sexy, intelligent, had a private plane and Mercedes etc. and oh well I was 25 and MORE than ready for you know what!)(So late because I tried to be the goodie goodie virgin till marriage - didn't work! I gave up trying on him!)
Although he thought he was superior to me (but it was HIM I think, not the culture!) he had mixed feelings re babies. On one hand he thought basically women DID throw their lives away in a sense when they had babies (their bodies, their careers etc.) On the OTHER hand he thought ALL women ended up wanting and usually having babies anyway and I would too. HA! Wrong AGAIN, Jazz!
He had a friend who he said really changed for the worse after having one too. (I met her, her husband and two - or three? I forget! - kids by the way.) He said (to me, privately!) she'd got a lot fatter since having them and her personality had changed for the worse. (Dumbed down I think?)
I think although he was a bit of a tosser really (again, I put that down to HIM, NOT being part Chinese!) Although he was a bit of a tosser (he liked to put me down verbally in the end but I let myself believe I was trash which I didn't believe when we started so it was partially my fault.) I learned SO much from that relationship and never regret it. It also helped with my childfree choice, even though I was childfree when we met it helped me further feel I was making the right choice for me.