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Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244250 04/30/06 06:11 AM
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Chipmunk
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I believe what Family chioce says....It has to be made as unpleasant as possible for them till the day they die and go and go to hell.

Killing them would be nice but I do think it is the easy way out for them.

We have a murderer here who gets constantley bashed and when he heals they just do it again - now that is justice...Apparentley he is so paranoid now he wont even eat his food because he thinks someone is poisioning him...Love it!!!!!

Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244251 04/30/06 08:55 AM
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Alexandra Offline
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Being glad for the misery of others seriously damages the privilege we have of being a human being...

The only difference here, may well be gender, but -

Do you have a body, as he has?
A head?
Two eyes?
A face, mouth, nose, ears, hair...?
A heart?
Two arms, and two legs, as he has....?

Then you are interchangeable... There, 'but for the grace of God' (some say) go you... under other circumstances, he may have been 'you' and you might have been 'him'... So as you live, breathe, see, hear, eat, speak, walk and exist as he does, there is no difference between you except for the choices made. Some may say he is reaping his karma now.

so be it.

But to be glad at his suffering....? To believe it to be commendable? To extract some enjoyment from his torture?
That's not nice.
In what I practise, re-birth in this cyclical existence does not discount that those we encounter today, might have been close friends, relatives or loved ones in a previous time.... So whoever we come across, is one with us, and we are one with them....

Freespirit, that's not like you.... I thought (as you mentioned in another thread) that you wanted to pursue your own specific, personal, private and individually-chosen path....

Is this it?

Last edited by Alexandra; 04/30/06 08:59 AM.
Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244252 04/30/06 11:21 AM
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greenspice Offline
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I'd be afraid if someone harmed my son that I would actually be able to 'pull the trigger', and I'm grateful for laws protecting me and others for that sort of impulse within myself. Because I can rationalise it when not feeling emotive, I know what I'd want for myself in those circumstances, and it's a sense of self-control, compassion, and hopefully forgiveness. I imagine I'd feel the total opposite. I do think that in terms of incarceration, 'life should mean life', regardless of the implications for taxpayers' money, because I believe that as a society we're mutually responsible for each other and killers etc. are just as much a product of our society as anyone else. Just my thoughts though...

best wishes - Jane <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Today is good <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244253 04/30/06 11:28 AM
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Chipmunk
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Alexandra this interchangable buisness makes no sense to me and you know what? I dont want it to because I think its a load of [censored]...

The fact is I am not "interchangable" I am not him and he is not me vice versa.

I dont care if it is not nice to be rejoicing in his torture because that is his Karma and he deserves every bit of what he is getting and more.

Freespirit, that's not like you.... I thought (as you mentioned in another thread) that you wanted to pursue your own specific, personal, private and individually-chosen path...Is this it?


The last paragraph is yours Alexandra just what has my opinion about the death penalty have to do with my spiritual path? "is this it"?

Is what it?

YOu read to much into things mate...I know you mean well and you have a kind heart but I am just expressing the way I feel and I know I dont sound "nice" but we are talking about real life here and this is a very serious issue.


What would you do with this individual who systematically blew 36 People away one nice sunny sunday arftenoon including a mum with here two children.One was killed in her arms allong with her - the other one he chased and killed her after she tried to hide behind a tree.I can tell you more horible details about that day but it probably would not mean anything to you as in the way you would treat him would it?

Okay Alexandra - You are the judge - you are about to hand down the punishment that this "man" shall recieve for his crime.

What do you do with him?

Does it Please society?

Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244254 04/30/06 01:13 PM
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Alexandra Offline
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Quote:
Alexandra this interchangable buisness makes no sense to me and you know what? I dont want it to because I think its a load of [censored]...


That's fine... I don't have a problem with that...providing you are able to tell me exactly why you know it to be [censored] (not why you think it is....There's a difference.....)


Quote:
I dont care if it is not nice to be rejoicing in his torture because that is his Karma and he deserves every bit of what he is getting and more.


He may deserve his karma - as we all do... but to rejoice in his suffering is consequential for you too...and therefore you are creating negative karma for yourself... Which I am sorry for.

Quote:
Just what has my opinion about the death penalty have to do with my spiritual path? "is this it"?

Is what it?


"I feel that it is no longer appropriate to discuss religion in any way in a public forum such as this because my relationship with my higher power is "not open to discussion" to anyone as I feel my relatronship with my higher power is sacred...It is very personal now...."

This is what you wrote in another thread... We cannot separate our spiritual path from our day-to-day existence... our Spiritual discipline should be at the very heart of everything we think, say and do....It should fuel every fibre of our being, non-stop.

Quote:
You read to much into things mate...I know you mean well and you have a kind heart but I am just expressing the way I feel and I know I dont sound "nice" but we are talking about real life here and this is a very serious issue.


I am talking about real life too; What other life, here and now, is there...?


Quote:
What would you do with this individual who systematically blew 36 People away one nice sunny sunday arftenoon including a mum with here two children.One was killed in her arms allong with her - the other one he chased and killed her after she tried to hide behind a tree.I can tell you more horible details about that day but it probably would not mean anything to you as in the way you would treat him would it?

Okay Alexandra - You are the judge - you are about to hand down the punishment that this "man" shall recieve for his crime.

What do you do with him?

Does it Please society?


Freespirit, I will tell you how it is with me...
I have to view this as I do all matters I face - on two levels...the first is with the practical, day-to-day, general socially-fed ideology of the Laws, Rules and Regulations which run society (which, incidentally, are all in their own turn, rooted in the Commandments handed down by God to Moses....)
Crimes must be punished, laws upheld and the innocent and law-abiding protected.
But I overview everything with my own particular Spiritual ethics as the fulcrum upon which I act....the basis and foundation of everything i think say and do, are the Compassion and Love I have to develop for my fllow man.
I am not here to please anyone; I am here to do what is right.
And actively, deliberately and purposefully wishing harm on another being, is wrong.
I do not deny that a punishment must be based on what Society has worked on and developped to guide, instruct and govern...But Retribution, through Killing and depriving of life, is not universally accepted, even in the USA. And as such, I cannot condone it.

Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244255 04/30/06 03:06 PM
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DarlingPoor Offline
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The questions isn't whether they are "animals" or "deserve to die," it's an ethical one.

You would want to become a murderer simply because you feel they deserve it?

Aren't you stooping to the murderer's level to be just like them? Would you feel clean after doing it? Would it make you feel good? I think they felt good after killing, too.

Quote:
Its never safe to presume everyone that is in favour of the death Penalty is also Pro - Choice but I think a majority of women on this forum are Pro - Choice.


I'm just trying to point a hypocrisy.


Darling Poor
Editor of Horses Site
Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244256 04/30/06 03:11 PM
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DarlingPoor Offline
Gecko
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Quote:
And it should happen quickly. In the first year at least


I want you to go to this web site and read about the 110 men who were freed from jail after wrongly being convicted and tell me that you wish they were murdered "right away".

Death Penalty Info Page


Darling Poor
Editor of Horses Site
Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244257 04/30/06 03:17 PM
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Darling Poor
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Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244258 04/30/06 08:42 PM
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Chipmunk
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Alexandra please do not bring up other issues I have disscussed in other threads as it does not belong here...
Sure I brought up the words "spiritual path" but that was only when you asked about my "path"

You are so full on!!lol.. Its Bloody hilarious.I dont have to explain to you why I think this interchangable buisness is [censored]..I dont wish to delve into it and if you have a problem with that then tough titties...

I DO NOT in any way shape or form wish to discuss this any further.

Lets just agree to disagree on this issue..It is an issue that evokes great emotion in alot of people and understandably so and when people have an opinion on this subject they are usually quite passionate about it - I have read you opinion and I respect your right to say it but please respect my right to say its a load of [censored].

Everyone knows how I feel and I guess most disagree but that is okay - this is a public forum and we are allowed to disagree and I do not have to explain my awnsers to you or anybody else as to why okay?

I know you feel the way you do because of your "personal beliefs" and good for you but please respect what I have to say(you dont have to agree)and not ask for explanations - I dont have to give one.

Thankyou and Peace be with you...

Re: what do you think of death penalty? #244259 04/30/06 11:11 PM
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Chelle - Marriage Editor Offline
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Chimpanzee
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I would be hard pressed to be "compassionate" should it come down to a case of murderers/rapists/etc. with children involved.

I know it should not make a difference- a life is a life, but what harm could a child ever have done an adult?

Like I said, I quite waver on this issue.

Freespirit, it seems like this issue is very personal for you, I am sorry that we have upset you so much over this. You are correct. You are entitled to your opinion, and do not have to defend it. I think we all have gotten used to devating around here! <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Please, I don't think anyone meant to cause you hurt.

This is another one of those "matters of the heart" that are not always completely logically explainable to someone else. one just knows deep in their gut how they themselves feel.

There have been men in jail that I felt truly deserved the death penalty, and still do. Manson is plain evil - everything he touched became evil - there is no reason for him to remain in this world. It was a horrible twist of fate <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> that let him slip through that timetable of no death penalty.

Like I said before though, my big fear is of putting someone to death that doesn't deserve it. If one day (I know someone pointed out many ways to prevent this) we can 100% be sure - then I will probably support it.

Except for rape - those men deserve castration - and if there is a way to remove the actual [censored] - then that, too!


Michelle Taylor
Marriage Editor
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