BellaOnline Forums Religion and Spirituality Bible Basics Does God Really Exist?

I do believe in something beyond us. Something greater than what we are. I can't explain it but I wouldn't call it, "God" the way most would and I most certainly not relate it to any christian form religion.


See the post under the "Da Vinci" thread

P.S. You are not icky or a bad man.....the questions you raise are refreshing.....I read here and then read in the other thread....I'm afraid that my comments are included in the other reply...lol once I get going...

Can you prove that God DOESN'T exist?

That statement proves that he doesn't exist. Or, atleast as Einstein stated, that he has no place in human affairs.

Beliefs are formed by being told, by assuming, and by evaluating scientifically. Each method has its ups and downs, but in the long run, only one method is even remotely important - the scientific method.

This chair would look to be empty if an invisible cat were in it. Therefore, there is without a doubt an invisible cat in this chair.

Right?

Hmmm....

You've taken a matter of faith and decided that you know more than God does. You've decided that, without many words that you, and you alone, have determined that God doesn't exist...because of a see-thru cat...

Hmmm...

I'm not convinced at all that you are confident in your argument.

I am not convinced that you can tangibly show me something in this world to PROVE God doesn't exist...enough to make me turn in my computer and stop spreading His Gospel to the lost.

No, that's not good enough. God's love and His Grace and His Mercy mean more to me than anything scientific someone with any God-given intellect can come up with to prove that He doesn't exist. After all, "Science" as we know it, is a gift from God.

So, try again...

Ok, I'm going to post a few parrys to the points that have been made here and then tell you how I know that "god" exists.

Jenna, in your first post, though i know that you retracted later on, you said that it is because they are searching that so many people visit the pagan and neo-ligious forums here. I find this statement rather presumptive and combative. I'm going to have to agree with Janet, Perhaps they've already found their version of god and want to learn from others journeys to find religion.
Ash then asked if we've ever thought that organized religion was created simply as a tool. There are historic records and examples of how an organized religion was purposefully used to scare the masses into conformity. Blasphemous of me to say so I know. But how else do you explain away the 7 or so layers of hell and pergatory and all the other hateful things that were pressed upon worshippers just so that they'd go to church and pay up every sunday? Yes, I know a contrite and tart example, but a factual one.
& Hurray for the "icky bad man's" of the world, with out them we would probably still be beating rocks together.
Jenna, you also say 'I am not convinced that you can tangibly show me something in this world to PROVE God doesn't exist'. In the other hand, you cannot TANGIBLY prove that he does.
Who is to be the judge of who is lost and who needs to hear his gospel? I have found most often in my experience that those who are most vehement to judge someones apparent lack of outward religion and tell them that they need to religion are those that are the most insecure and questioning of their own faith; looking for more people like themselves so that they feel like a part of a whole and a better person.
I have experienced or studied several religions and have found that there is one underlying theme that is common amongst all of them. That there is an all knowing, all powerful something. As a friend of mine put it: 'or in some is an all powerful force that is totally undescribable, unfathomable and what binds every single being that believes in good and evil, together in one community - wherther the koran, the bible, the whatever - it boils down to faith in something mightier than the frailties of human existence and the ability to overcome life by that belief'. And he, she, it has a boundless love for you no matter what. It is when one religion says that theirs is better that bloodshed and hatred ensues, this isn't what was meant to happen.

In short, the bible says "you will see, feel and sense this" (if I butchered it I apologize). There fore, if you believe, (I'm going to use my preferred term of choice now) Creator will make himself known to you however he feels that he can reach you. Whether it be through numerolgy, animals, coincidences, "warm fluffy feelings", dreams, prayer, whatever.

I, myself, follow a Native American path. My church is all around me; inside, outside, it doesnt matter. Creator is in everything. From the first hint of green in March, to a mans last dying breath.

How do I know that something above all this [censored] on earth exists? Because there is such a thing as love.

Yes, I know it all sounds terribly sappy and had I read this myself a few years ago I would have been reaching for a barf bag. But tis what I have come to know as an adult.

Final note; Jenna, to have a tenacious and boundless faith such as yours is a beautiful thing. Just remember to give it as a gift instead of using it as a power. Trying to convert the lost isn't necessarily the answer to all the problems in life.

x0x Wendy - sorry for prattling on for forever and a day =

Quote: Who is to be the judge of who is lost and who needs to hear his gospel? I have found most often in my experience that those who are most vehement to judge someones apparent lack of outward religion and tell them that they need to religion are those that are the most insecure and questioning of their own faith; Unquote

I can't speak for Jenna, but I have found that some of us that occasionaly come across forcefully when we speak of our belief do so because we have been on other paths. I searched and studied other beliefs (some of them I now call cults). After having become a believer in Jesus Christ I recognized the difference. - Too amazing to put into words.

Quote: looking for more people like themselves so that they feel like a part of a whole and a better person.Unquote
Of course that might fit anyone in any belief system, but I think it is really a shallow way of looking at people. It is more likely a true, deep feeling of wanting to help someone in need.

There are three things I specifically want to comment on right away.

Jenna, you also say 'I am not convinced that you can tangibly show me something in this world to PROVE God doesn't exist'. In the other hand, you cannot TANGIBLY prove that he does.

I have found that when someone who is not a born again, saved believer and follower of Jesus asks me to prove that God does exist; when their statement is turned around on them, they conclude, without further discussion, that God must not really exist because one of His followers is asking for Him to be disproven. That is not the case. I just get so much flack sometimes about exclaiming the joy in a personal relationship with Him, that, for once, I'd like to see some concrete evidence that God doesn't exist. So far, nothing. Not enough for me to throw in the towel. It's not meant to be combative.

I am not convinced that you can tangibly show me something in this world to PROVE God doesn't exist...enough to make me turn in my computer and stop spreading His Gospel to the lost.
This is what I posted in response to "Signifyer" and I still stick by it. If someone can show me how their heart has been changed by NOT having a life saving personal relationship with Christ, I would be willing to look at it. Until then, I will continue to spread His gospel and fight the good fight in His name. I'm honest and straight forward and I have a tendancy to not back down. You won't get name calling or put-downs from me. The love of Christ is what you will be shown. But, I believe that respect is not tolerance and if it's not Biblical, I won't support it.

Jenna, in your first post, though i know that you retracted later on, you said that it is because they are searching that so many people visit the pagan and neo-ligious forums here. I find this statement rather presumptive and combative. I'm going to have to agree with Janet, Perhaps they've already found their version of god and want to learn from others journeys to find religion.

I love Janet. She and I approach our subjects with passion. I respect Janet's ability to write and she has been very successful. But, here at the Christianity site, I'm not touting organized religion, per se, I am all for a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, the Son of God and the redeemer of my soul. Christianity is not a denomination. It is a way of life. It's not about church and doctrine. It's about Jesus Christ. I think sometimes people get confused by religiousity.

All in all, I asked the beginning question out of frustration on a bad day. Not to start a fight or anything. I was and still am curious where people find God. What does He represent in their lives. Where is the evidence personally. You answered it, I think, without even knowing.

I, myself, follow a Native American path. My church is all around me; inside, outside, it doesnt matter. Creator is in everything. From the first hint of green in March, to a mans last dying breath.
How do I know that something above all this [censored] on earth exists? Because there is such a thing as love.

God is love. God is all around us all the time. God knows our hearts and desires for us to fellowship with Him uniquely (sp).

I can't speak for Jenna, but I have found that some of us that occasionaly come across forcefully when we speak of our belief do so because we have been on other paths. I searched and studied other beliefs (some of them I now call cults). After having become a believer in Jesus Christ I recognized the difference. - Too amazing to put into words.

Lynn takes the words right out of my mouth.

Hi all ... this topic matter is something ppl have been discussing for years, yet it seems that many of our answers are based upon our own beliefs .. I sometimes wonder if we paint the picture of God based upon our own belief system.

Well I believe we all have a creator ... that God exists, yet ask me to prove it and I cannot ... how can you prove something which you believe in your soul? I coudln't persuade anyone either, yet I do believe that if ppl earnstly seek God that it is then that they have found God ... whether it be in forums or elsewhere ... God surely has a purpose for each of our lives, should it matter what forum we find ourselves in or how we draw closer to God?

For me God is that mystery that cannot be completely unfolded by humans, to say that we completely understand God would be difficult for me to understand as there is so much that we do not know. Yet I beleive that God exists, and I believe that we are all children of God and that God loves us all and that we should learn from our creator and become more LIKE God ... that we should learn to love others as God loves them ...

There are so many mysteries and so many ppl who proclaim to know all the answers ... yet when the words cease, and the silence finds it's home .. it is then that I truly know that God is with me ... as He is with us all.

....

Goosie

Goosie,

I don't think anyone could have answered the initial question with any more grace and fortitiude than you. Thank you.

I'm not going to get into the discussion of whether God exists or not. I believe he does and I cannot prove it to anyone else nor do I want to try. I look at my children and I know he does. Yes, there may be a scientific reason behind it, but I choose to believe it is because they are a miracle.
I received a forward the other day from a Christian friend of mine. It was talking about why is there so much suffering in the world if God exists and the punchline was that the people that suffer have not accepted Jesus. Oh my, that is the junk that gives Christians a bad name.
I do not go to church because I do not want to hear a man's version of what God intended me to know. I grew up in a Southern Baptist environment (West Texas). It has taken many years to deprogram. Now, I have my relationship with God and I have no reason to condemn anyone else's choice in religion because I believe when you are spiritual and not religious, you are sharing the same God.
Nicci