The last time I checked, we live in the greatest country in the world. What on Earth is this man thinking? (I found this clip on youtube)

BellaOnline ALERT: Raw URLs are not allowed in these forums for security reasons. Please use UBB code. If you don't know how to do UBB code just post here for help - we will help out!

I am appalled that someone who is running for President of our country could treat our flag and what it stands for in such a manner. Is that not an open sign to the world that he has no respect for our flag and our country? Was it my imagination or did Hillary and the others seem embarrassed?

I don't care anymore because after Big Media and Big Money floated him into the nomination I decided to change my political affiliation at the earliest possible opportunity allowed by my state. I am looking at the New American Independent Party.

people people people... he is not refusing to salute the american flag. When the national anthem is played, you are to stand in respect. When the pledge of allegience is recited, then you put your hand over your heart. People have made a mountain out of a mole-hill and over NOTHING. I don't put my hand over my heart for the national anthem. Some people do, but it is NOT required.

there are more important issues out there than whether someone put their hand over their heart for the national anthem. Let's not worry about that. Let's worry about outrageous gas prices, the housing crises, the value of the dollar, etc etc etc

Well said Jase,

agreed jase and excellent point about the national anthem difference.

I understand the difference between the Pledge of Allegiance and the National Anthem. But, did you notice, that out of respect, everyone else there put their hand over their heart? I always do, and, although I am sure some do not do that, I have never seen someone who is running for President, not do it.

Maybe I am overreacting, but, I just think it is done out of respect, like everyone else on the platform did. I see it as a sign of either stubborness or rebellion since everyone else there put their hand over their heart.

there was an interview where someone asked him why he didn't when everyone else did. He said, I never do. It is not decorum to do so, and I was taught not to like most other american school children. He said he does for the pledge, but not for the anthem as I stated why I didn't either.

Well, I do not know where he went to school at, but most Americans I know and all the kids I went to school with were taught to put their hand over their heart, like all the other Americans in that video with Obama did. Of course, to each his own. I just see it as a sign of disrepect, but, then most of us to what we were raised to do.

hand over the heart for the anthem or the pledge. Anywhere I have ever been asked us to stand for the playing of the national anthem.

Hubby and I were discussing this, and we both said stnad for the anthem, hand over heart for the pledge.

The reason being - you place your hand over your heart during the pledge to show your sincerity in the words that you are saying - like in court raising one hand and placing the other on the Bible.

But during the anthem, you are not saying any words, just standing in respect - not even really of the song, but of the flag (or both).

Technically the people that should place hand ove heart during the anthem would be anyoine who is singing it - because they would be offering up the words from their own mouths. But I have sang the anthem many times as part of differing choirs, and we have never done so.

We really ought to ask Jeff of the Veterans site, as ex-military, he would know exactly the proper protocol for both anthem and pledge.

I agree Phyllis. Everything in my gut when I watched this, (it grabbed me in my stomach) video, and I trust this, is he did this out of defiance w/a little, "Well, I really didn't mean anything by it..." for the public. Not a chance on this one!

I get the impression this action had to do w/something having to do w/sums of money/champagne and loyalty to the donor, type thing. Just yuck!

To some, and anything can be justified, it could be brushed under the carpet. But, and this part isn't a feeling, just my opinion, if I'm in the public eye and my intentions are to lead a country in unity and strength, I believe the things that are going to accomplish such a feat in addition to passion are going to be demonstration of support of the things most meaningful to the country.

I would never start this path with any type of disrespect in this country or any other. In some, it's disrespectful to show the soles of your shoe. I would make sure my feet were firmly and I mean firmly planted at all times. I would learn their culture and embrace it.

The things that are coming through, outside of my opinion, hit me before I followed anything of this person. Since then, really, I've noticed much more than just this video. And in all honesty it's like falling down a rabbit hole.

I remember when Powell was going to run for president. I didn't get anything close to this type of feeling with him and was sad he pulled out. i haven't been too excited w/anyone that would call attention since then. With Bush it felt money would be the issue. We were personally in that 911 thing so I can't say I saw it coming for the entire country,. I just hated and avoided airports and felt like we were going to be hijacked any minute. Toward the end of the year my folks invited us out East. I think I decisded to be drunk for the most part of that trip!

Elleise
Clairvoyance Editor

Very good thoughts, Elleise. If a person is in that position, then definitely a positive attitude of respect for the country should be exhibited. I cringe when I think about the fact that a lot of young people look to the President as a role model. I do not like to think that a whole generation would take this type of thing as an example of what to do when our National Anthem is sung. Military people salute the flag during this song and non-military Americans do what everyone else on that stage did, put their hands over their hearts.

Alot of young people feel frustrated in general, with people not getting along.

Their energetic motivations in commercials, trends, dress wear, etc. They scream - relax, keep it real!! Many have been dismissed or raised in frustration w/parents having to work so much to give them the things and opportunities they have. I'll bet many parents wish they had more time instead of working two jobs or having to go back to work or dipping into retirement funds. Most parents didn't enjoy it, but were determined just to make it. they may be too young to realize this or maybe it's been so long it's just norm.

- It's a cycle -

Parents end up feeling guilty so gift their children, the children are able to embrace something that makes them feel good and comfortable in lieu of intimacy. Eventually resentment sets in because it's simply not a means to an end.

Then they look at the state our country is in and feel now is the time for change. Correct in drive, but politics are worse than any commercial out there, you'll ever see.

All this during a time most everyone is wanting change for the tightened economy and increasing energy costs.

____________________________________________

Elleise
Clairvoyance Editor

Obama is not my favorite person for a few reasons, but I think I saw him singing the anthem. Maybe he can't chew gum and rub his tummy at the same time.

And personally, I can't remember what I do when the anthem plays, I have to wait until I get to the next ballgame and see what happens. It is like reciting a phone number LOL, if I need to give it to you I can recite it, if you ask me what it is I don't know...I'm getting old, or senile, or both. LOL.

Sorry, but you don't put your hand over heart for the anthem. I served in the Army for 6 years and my husbands retired Army. At ALL military functions we attended we NEVER put our hand over our heart during the anthem.

from Flag Etiquette:

The Salute
To salute, all persons come to attention. Those in uniform give the appropriate formal salute. Citizens not in uniform salute by placing their right hand over the heart and men with head cover should remove it and hold it to left shoulder, hand over the heart. Members of organizations in formation salute upon command of the person in charge.

The Pledge of Allegiance and National Anthem
The pledge of allegiance should be rendered by standing at attention, facing the flag, and saluting.

When the national anthem is played or sung, citizens should stand at attention and salute at the first note and hold the salute through the last note. The salute is directed to the flag, if displayed, otherwise to the music.

Thank you for looking that up LindaSue. The next question I would have is whether or not people believe he it mere mere ignorance or is this indicitave of his plans for this country. If everyone will indulge my slight tangent here, I have an additional thought
Mr. Obama's party leaders and colleagues in Congress have openly shown disdain for this country's military. They have declared the war LOST repeatidly within the first three weeks of the recent military surge just after they unanimously vote for it. Mr. Obama has repeatidly said he was against the war from the beginning because he says it was based on false pretenses (Their were no WMDs). The truth has come out that there were WMDs and that Saddahm was testing them on his own people. Yet Obama is still saying that we should never have been there. His party is still saying the administration lied about the whole thing. I could go on and on, but I will probably save it for another post.
My point to all this is, the job Mr. Obama is seeking (this is my understanding) is to be the supreme leader of our military. Why is he a candidate for this position? His party has shown disdain for the military and this country, and he has shown disdain for the military and this country.
Anyone can take any of these issues (Rev. Wright, not saluting to the anthem, his bitter americans clinging to their guns and bibles comments, his affiliations with Tony Rezko, his flag lapell "flip-flop", his rejection of public financing, his comment about visiting all "60" states in America, ect. ect.) and, Jase you are right in saying that this could be making a mountain out of a mole hill, but when all of these things are lumped together, don't they show that this man is not right for the leader of this country? He fits in perfectly in the Senate, I have never seen a more corrupt body of people with as much power as they have and without term limits no less.
I guess my point is that we can talk all day about what doesn't qualify this man to be president, but I think the question that should be asked is what DOES qualify him to be president.

He has shown leadership as a community activist in the south side of Chicago, but has anything changed there for the better? He has been an Illinois Senator, but has anything changed for the better in Illinois because of him? He has been a US Senator and has anything changed for the better do to him?

What are we hoping for with this man? How much are we deluding ourselves by dismissing his everyday actions, comments, and views?

Where does he show his patriatism and leadership abilities?


-whoisjohngalt

You makes excellent points. Part of the problem is that so many people hate the current president so much that it would not really matter who the Dems put up for nomination. That is obviously why they chose their weakest contenders. Look at all the experience they had to choose from: Chris Dodd, Joe Biden. Bill Richardon is even a governor, and the voters like to elect governors because they have executive experience.

But no, the Democrats chose novelty over substance and experience. Does any Democrat really believe that Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can raise taxes and expand government any better than any other Democrat candidate?

If Dodd, Biden, or Richardson were their candidate now, he would be clobbering McCain in the polls, instead of the dead heat we have now.

Obama seems like such a "breath of fresh air" to those who do not look at what he actually says, what he is for, and what he says he will do. He is na�ve in some ways and an obfuscating ordinary politician in many others.

But as many pundits keep saying, it is the Dems' year, and so there is every possibility that Obama will win. It has little to do with the candidate, and everything to do with false impressions so many people have been indoctrinated to believe about the current Republican administration.

Thomas Sowell has an article that also address this Obama thing:

An excerpt:
As the hypnotic mantra of �change� is repeated endlessly, few people even raise the question of whether what few specifics we hear represent any real change, much less a change for the better.

Raising taxes, increasing government spending, and demonizing business? That is straight out of the New Deal of the 1930s.

The New Deal was new then but it is not new now. Moreover, increasing numbers of economists and historians have concluded that New Deal policies are what prolonged the Great Depression.

Putting new restrictions of international trade, in order to save American jobs? That was done by Herbert Hoover, when he signed the Hawley-Smoot tariff when the unemployment rate was 9 percent. The next year the unemployment rate was 16 percent and, before the Great Depression was over, unemployment hit 25 percent.

For the rest of the article: Are facts obsolete?

What would it look like if the country followed Obama's lead?

BellaOnline ALERT: Raw URLs are not allowed in these forums for security reasons. Please use UBB code. If you don't know how to do UBB code just post here for help - we will help out!

I think I've seen this debated elsewhere and Obama has had a reason why he does not put his hand over his heart etc. I wish I could remember where I read the reasoning behind it.

Here's a link to the snopes article on it. I think it gives out some explanations. Thanks for sharing the video. I hadn't seen it yet.

I do think that after hearing his first debate he sounds more for the American people than I previously thought. Hopefully it was sincere.

Yes, there is already a thread on this. And it was actually started by "Whoisjohngalt" in the exact same way, so I am not sure why a 2nd thread is being started on this same topic.

I've merged this thread with the other one, so we only have one discussion going.