BellaOnline Forums Relationships Married No Kids I used to be more of a liberal

I used to feel a lot more for poor people. But it seems like the majority of them are there because of their own doing. I've just seen too many people who don't want to help themselves, they want to rely on the government. Rather, they think the government is responsible for cleaning them up.

I'm liberal, but when it comes to this, I am conservative. Because I think that people need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. I don't like it when people expect others to dig them out of the hole they're in.

My DH and I were JUST having this conversation this morning. Something came on TV as we were both getting ready for work regarding the housing mortgage crisis that is going on here in the states. You know, I feel badly for people who are about to lose their homes to foreclosures and adjustable rate mortgages that went up BUT, that said...why oh why did all of these people buy homes they couldn't afford and take out loans that they KNEW were a ticking bomb?

We built and bought a new home in July. We knew what we could afford and what we couldn't. We took out a traditional, mortgage with a fixed rate. Period. I felt that if we couldn't pay a traditional mortgage, then we couldn't afford the house. We live in Maryland where the housing market has absolutely skyrocketed and everyone was buying these McMansions with McMortgages attached. DH and I can pay our mortgage payments every month and we are able to save money too. Our mortgage payment is high compared to other parts of the country but it is workable for us...and it comes along with the territory of living in a nice part of Maryland.

What I said this morning was this...if Someone/a Couple makes $4000 a month in income, why do they think that they can pay out $4500 a month in bills and other necessities?? Do the math people. If your bills each month come out to more than you earn each month - then you are living beyond your means and then some! I think people feel that just because they WANT something means that they should have it. This is how people end up in big trouble. It is sad...but it is happening in this country everyday. Like I sad, I don't want to see anyone be "down and out" but use your heads. If something sounds too good to be true, especially when a mortgage is involved, then it probably is. People bought into the lie and now they are paying for it.

Something my hubby said when we were buying our house that I found insightful was, "People mistakely assume that when you're buying a house that everyone has your best interest in mind." And he's right. You hear all the time, people saying things like, "Oh they won't approve us for more than we can handle paying." So not true. Especially when you're dealing with mortgage brokers. They just want the commission and they'll find a way to get you to sign under the guise of helping you realize your dream of home ownership.

Very wise! I've even read articles that say, "Get preapproved for a mortgage before going house shopping. That will tell you how much you can afford." So, rather than people figuring it out for themselves, they're allowing a broker to tell them how much they can afford. That is a very crooked industry anyway, so it's crazy to believe everything they say.

We had an ARM mortgage for a short time, to help us buy a house before we sold our previous one. We were really nervous about it, and anxious to switch to a fixed, and did that as soon as possible. Thank GOD we did, or we'd probably have gone bankrupt by now or lost our house. If something makes you nervous, it's important to listen to that.

It used to be this way before Bush deregulated everything. When we were buying our first house we were told that they didn't used to approve a mortgage that cost more than 1/4 of your income. At that time, they wouldn't approve more than 1/3 your income, which was very wise! Now, anything goes.

I feel very sorry for the people who were duped and I think they should be helped. (On a case by case basis of course. If you can't afford your house, you can't afford it.) I don't feel sorry for people who were speculating, however. They shouldn't be helped. They speculated, they lose.

>Plus, once they start getting into their pre-teens, they'll start whining about wanting nicer clothes, guaranteed.

I'll grant you that greater than 50% probably would, but certainly not all. My ds is 16, and although he has certain shirts he prefers -- and prefers to wear black jeans -- he doesn't care particularly, and certainly the brand is irrelevant to him. Fit and comfort, sure, but that's it. (Now, MY big problem is getting him to care MORE about what he wears! An atypical problem, I admit.)

But with three children, there is also the option of hand-me-downs, something I didn't have a lot of, since I was the only girl. (I did have some, though.)

> I've just seen too many people who don't want to help themselves, they want to rely on the government. Rather, they think the government is responsible for cleaning them up.

Yeah, I agree with this -- as a society, we seem to have fallen into the trap of thinking the government is supposed to take care of us, rather than we are supposed to be responsible adults. Given what we keep hearing, between the lies, the corruption and the incompetence, I can't imagine wanting to rely on the gov't!

> BUT, that said...why oh why did all of these people buy homes they couldn't afford and take out loans that they KNEW were a ticking bomb?

You mean, they don't deserve it because they want it? (eyes rolling) That ties back into that concept of personal responsibility, and expecting Big Brother to take care of them. It is much easier to not have to worry about little details like reality.

If it were only really low intelligence people falling into this trap, I would say it was because they weren't bright enough to realize it. But there are too many who were just plain greedy, wanted more than they could afford, and now are looking for a bailout. And you and I will be paying for it.

Sigh.

You know what's funny is I just read a horse blog the other day where the blogger was talking about a news article about a crapload of horses that were starving on some property. The owners moaned and cried about how hay has gone up in price, and that the government should help people like them out. As the blogger screamed, horses are a luxury. Big cars are a luxury. Owning a freakin' house, a luxury. You get them if you can afford them, and get a REASONABLE amount. If hay is so expensive, then maybe you should try selling some of those horses instead of BREEDING MORE (which they were doing). If gas is so expensive, then sell that gas guzzling machine and get something more fuel-efficient, or :: gasp :: RIDE THE BUS. Ride a bike even! Try walking for a change.
Something even more galling was that the couple remarked snidely that someone probably saw their horses and tattled on them. I WISH more people would hold others accountable for what they're doing, especially when animals are involved. >:P
By the way, I'd be considered an extreme liberal when it comes to human behavior, but when it comes to the government blowing money I'd be a conservative. If money was handed to these people, they wouldn't change one whit, they'd just blow all the money and beg for more.

Ha ha! That is a problem with boys. I have to say though, 50% is possibly more accurate for boys, but for girls I would bet the percentage is much higher. And there's not an easy way to guarantee you'll give birth to a nice, easygoing, nonmaterialistic boy, unfortunately. Especially in this day and age of metrosexuals!

Of course, a parent can always be firm and say "No" to high-fashion clothes, but I'm just saying, I don't want to have to fight someone all the time on that.

I realize there is no way I can ever completely understand this. I think of all the women I've read about who say they buy tons of clothes for their kids and feel guilty about buying clothes for themselves. I'd probably feel the same way! But, I'd also feel weird about having kids who dressed way better than me, and just being the frump in the background.

I am totally the same way!

Frieda, I love consignment stores! I buy all my jeans there - you can get $100+ designer jeans in the consignment stores for about $10-$15. Sometimes they look brand new, and given that I just wreck my clothes anyway (still a tomboy) it's great! I've also found some pretty cool streetwear (hoodies, tees, etc) at a fraction of the store prices - name brand streetwear is so ridiculously expensive, I'd never buy it otherwise. A while ago I picked up a nice black and grey sweater that I thought would be good for work - when I got it home and checked it out, it was pure merino and spotless - not bad for $12!!

Agreed about the whole entitlement thing. I can't believe the amount that some of my friends pay out for their mortgages, car leases, cellphone bills, eating out and clothes. I live in a city where there's a lot of people with a lot of cash, and an whole lot of posing going on ... I just don't see the point of it, but so many people here buy into the "have to have" culture. One friend thinks nothing of buying $500 worth of lingerie and $250 worth of makeup, and then complains when her rent doubles ... if she'd bought a place five years ago, her mortgage payments would be half her rent cost now.

Sigh. I think "Live Within Your Means" should be a compulsory subject in high school.