BellaOnline Forums Religion and Spirituality Bible Basics Is The Old Testament - Fact, Fable or Myth?

One wonders how many readers of the Old Testament, if asked the above question, would reply by repeating what they had read in the introduction to their Bible. They might answer that, even though it was written by men inspired by the Holy Ghost, the author was God. What do you feel about the old testament?

Hi! I mentioned this over in the other "obstacles to believers" discussion, but I'll repeat it. I've been a Christian since '97, but i have only really gotten excited about the Word and a closer realtionship to God in this past year (becasue of a lot of things that happened good and bad). Now I am enjoying studying (although if I am not careful, I spend too much time chatting) <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> My husband got this wonderful program for my computer called "Quickverse", it has like 10 different versions of the Bible on it, several devotionals, several study guides & theological guides, and dictionaries & reference materials. It has been really neat.

Anyway (I do have a point), looking at all this stuff, yes I believe the old testament is fact. It is God's Word and we can trust it. I feel especially strong when it says that God spoke certain words, that those were His words, verbatim. For example; the 10 commandments, the versions are different in Exodus and Deuteronomy. Esodus' version is more straitforward whereas Deutronomy's is more legalese in keeping with the whole theme of that book, The theory is that the one in Exodus is where Moses presented the tablet to the Israelite the 1st time on the mountain - straight from God and read verbatim, what God had given Him, because let's face it, I certainly wouldn't be able to think coherently after that. In Deutoronmy is later when Moses was setting forth ALL the laws to the Nation that God had given him, being imperfect in memory, he probably paraphrased a little and put it in the official legal tongue he was used to, so not a verbatim statement. (This in came from "Hard Sayings of the Bible")

SO that's how I think most of the old testament is. It is God's word, written by imperfect man. When it said God spoke it is probably remembered, because that is just not something that would leave your mind. And I believe all other facts are true as well, it just certain areas where I think we do not have the understanding of what God is speaking about that maybe things are muddy.

Genesis: creation: God created the world in 7 days- but is a day to God 24 hours, after all man came up with that definition of a day, maybe to God a day was 10,000 years to us, maybe that is why the earth is so old.
Longevity of man before the flood: skeletons have shown that man has gone through some evolution (NOT from a MONKEY!) Did man living so long before the great flood have something to do with the way homo-erectus was built as opposed to homo-sapiens?
Noah's ark: God instructed Noah to carry 7 pr. of birds, 7 pr of CLEAN animals, but only 1 pr of UNCLEAN animals, does this explain the extinction of the dinosaurs? A world-wide flood would definitely count as a global catastrophe!

I guess the real question is can we even fathom God, and does it matter? He tells us to trust His Word, and go on Faith, that should be enough for us.

Thanks for letting me ramble!

I have always been taught that the Bible is all true. God spoke it, man wrote it down. Of course it's been changed from its original language, and if you can find the original versions of it, it is amazing! I've been a Christian for many years and have had God see me through many trials. Many things in the Old Testament lead to happenings in the New Testament. The more I study, the more I hunger for His word. God has time and time again shown His love caring and kindness for His creation, man, through the pages of His word. Yes, and His humor too, God definitely has a sense of humor. Ah, it's good to me a Christian. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />
Oh yes, He definitely has a sense of humor! I just wish I was on the same page as him sometimes. I didn't mean to imply I didn't believe the O.T., I just meant it is sort of like Revelations; man may not have always understood what they were writing about.

And I agree about Him being good, He has done some amazing things in our lives this past year, it just took us getting out of His way in order for Him to do it!

Thanks!

If the Old testament is fact than why do so many people disregard it as just "old" lol...

Jesus said "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." Mathew 5:17

Why do Christians eat pork and dont get circumsised?
I have heard many answers to this but I am always searching for more because I strive for the truth.

Ok, I'm going to write this with the caveat that I'm going to come back once I've had a chance to find the specific verses running around in my head! (I do know some of them already...)

But Jesus came as a "New Covenant" - foretold in Jerehmiah 31:31, then explained in greater detail in Hebrews 8, 9, & 12. This covenant made many of the laws set forth by the priests unnecessary.

Basically if you go through the New Testament Christ reiterates the laws that are important to be kept (which include all of the ten commandments, although they are not mentioned in order or together.)

Many of the old testament laws were put in place by God for health reasons. (I had a very interesting semester of microbiology taught by a dual Dr. biology/ theology!)

In the times of the new testament, men did not know enough about diseasessuch as trichinosis or cooking meats to such and such temperature to get rid of bacteria or worms, so it is believed that was the reson God prohibited the eating of certain foods back then; to prevent sickness. In the New Testament He instructs (Ack I get these disciples mixed up, sorry I', kind of new to this in depth studying thing) Paul to eat many things and says they are fine beacause He says so!

Circumcision is the same thing. A circumcised [censored] is much easier to keep clean than an uncircumcised one. And the instructions to wait until the 9th day coincides with the day that a baby has the highest level of antibodies in his body.

Sending women out of camp or village while on their period, having them bury their bloody clothing, bathe, and receive new clothing before coming back into camp also insured that diseases and bacteria that would thrive in the blood would not be passed around, and the woman would be clean when she returned to her people.

However we do not need all of these precations these days. And God knew we would not, so He did not make these laws part of the new covenant.

The priests had gotten too tied up with who was following which laws how well. God wants us to focus on Him. So the New Covenant is about Him and sharing His love with His children so that all may come to know Him.

Whew, sorry I took so long. I hope I explained my beliefs OK, and I hope I did not offend anyone, that was not my intent. That semester of microbiology HAD gotten my interest up however, so I did a bit of studying on the subject. (Although I gurantee, Dr. Key did a much better job of explaining it!) <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Thank you very much for your reply..
Some of your answers gave very good reasons for abrogating some of the laws.
However I feel that none of them really cover the reasons fully.

Wasnt the covenent with the prophet Abraham to kept by all of the Lords creation until the end of time?

Concerning pork, the answer you have given is only the opinion of your own and scientists who have tried to find a reason to make pork a legal meat. Yes it is now the widely accepted Christian reason for eating pork, but where in the bible does it mention that it is ok now?

Concerning circumsision the only person to make it legal was Pual (Saul) in what he refers to be "his gospel" (Romans 2:16)
Since all the prophets of the bible were circumsised and all were carrying the direct wishes from God, woulld they not have known best??
Or paul? Just some food for thought...

Paul mentions that if you are circumsised physically than Christ has not benifited you.
But before the advent of paul all the prophets also mentioned not to associate idols and partners with God.
And it was paul who introduced the idea of the "trinity"..

If you claim "Christ reiterates the laws that are important to be kept" (quoted from yourself)
Than why did not mention the ones that were not so important?
I think circumsision is quite important since god made it such a requirement for the other prophets.
Even to this day people are getting infections and dieses due to the fact that they are not circumsised.

I respect people who follow the laws of the bible. But when I am given examples set by paul I always have to look at things twice.
Because he was like hitler was to the Jews. Only I believe he realised that if you cant wipe a sect out physically, you should try to do it idiologically.

Dont forget that Paul confesses in "his gospels" that while he was preaching one form of Christianity there were other forms being preaced too. So there is no doubt in my mind that what we have today is not exactly what may have been than. (Galatians 1:6-9 and 2 Corinthians 11:3-6)

Also he admits that the form he preaches was specialy revealed to him to appeal to the gentiles. So it definately isnt the same doctrines taught by Jesus to his desciples. (Galatians 1:11-20)

This was dealt with when there were large numbers of gentile Christians. It was decided in Jerusalem, and is recorded in the New Testament, that gentiles were not to be held to the Jewish laws.

Jesus clearly stated that He and the Father were One.

Where in the bible is this decided? Was mentioned by Jesus himself?
What does your claim that Jesus is one with God have to do with people giving up the laws of the old testament???

Infact when you say that Jesus and God were one, Im assuming since you never gave reference to your claim (as I have done in my text) that you are refering to the verse in the chapter of John.

"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, and these three are one." (John 5:7)

This above text was ommited from the bible in 1952 translation because it was found that that particular verse did not exist in the most ancient manuscripts.

The Revised Standard Version (RSV) of the Bible first appeared in 1952. The editors claimed in the preface that it went to the "most ancient manuscripts" of the Bible. By "most ancient" they mean those that date 200 to 300 years after Jesus. "Ancient" manuscripts on the other hand, on which the King James Version was based, date 400 to 600 years after Jesus. All scholars agree that none of the originals of any of the manuscripts exist. All we have are "most ancient" and "ancient" copies.

The preface to the RSV says that it was produced by thirty two scholars of "the highest eminence", backed by "fifty cooperating denominations (of Christianity)." Historically, since the RSV goes back to the "most ancient" manuscripts it is more accurate than the KJV. About halfway down the preface of the RSV, on page one, these fifty-two scholars unanimously declare:

The King James Version has grave defectsand that these defects are so many and so serious as to call for a revision (1952:1)

OK, I found it! (I like using the English Standard Version, for ease of reading; but I found the same passage in the New King James, too) This is From James 10:22-42.