When I started my spiritual path 35 years ago the word used was pride,now all we ear or read is ego.
Just googled and wikied both words and ego as such does not exist only as a beginning of a word,the real term is Pride .

Ego is not a word in my vocabulary because it does not exist ,it is only a root.Being modern is fine but changing the real meanings of words is another thing.

I expect a lot of rebuttals, and this is what I want.
But first be sure to check ,your references.

With love of truth
_/\_
a simple buddhist named
loong

Hello Loong,

How can you just delete a word from the language and say it does not exist because it is not in your vocabulary? Or am I missing the point? Probably.

Am interested in your response ... Freudians around the world will disagree with you I am afraid; ancient Romans too, but then I also know a couple of people who debunk Freud as a nobody who did nothing so I guess there is an argument for any standpoint in life! And anyway who speaks, studies, reads and enjoys Latin these days?

Cheers

Dear Lestie,
ego means I,period.

A simple buddhist named
loong

Dear Leslie,

It seems you have not given your references.I did not say that ego is not a word in itself,Wikipedia did.Read Wiki for ego and read Wiki for pride.These are my sources.What are yours?

With respect
a simple buddhist named
loong

Greetings, Loong.

You did say that ego is not a word because it "does not exist". Are you saying that the word ego is not in dictionaries? I say ego is a word that defines self. If you type "define ego" in your search engine, you will come up with many links that verify ego as a word with definitions. For instance:

Bing Dictionary:
Ego


Wikipedia, Ego is a Latin word meaning 'I'
..."often used in English to mean the 'self'


Merriam Webster Dictionary
Ego - noun
"the one of the three divisions of the psyche in psychoanalytic theory that serves as the organized conscious mediator between the person and reality especially by functioning both in the perception of and adaptation to reality"

Answers.com
"Historically speaking, after Freud's death the notion of the ego eventually became the central preoccupation of psychoanalysis, to the detriment of the id."

I understand what you say that the word ego does not exist in your vocabulary, that is fine. Some words do not exist in my vocabulary either, yet they are in the dictionary.

Dear Phyllis,

If you read my last post on this thread ,i wrote that it did mean I.
However it seems to me that nobody understands what I am saying.
I, is neither positive nor negative.Yet people use I like it is something that is wrong.What is wrong is pride.That is what I meant in my first post. Check it out. Tell me please what is wrong with I? Checked your referrals they all say the same thing
ego=I,or is a root to further completion of words.

Pride used to be the bad guy,and someone ,some day, changed pride for an Innocent Word I, again I repeat is neutral.

With respect
_/\_
a simple budddhist called
loong

To Phyllis,

Please tell me where it is said ,that I and Self are bad.
Pride is.

With respect

A simple buddhist named
loong

To all,
Here is the definition of pride,as I know it ,has nothing to do with the word I or self which by themselves are neutral.

Pride:The "idealized self," the "tyranny of the should," the "pride system" and the nature of self-hate all point toward the intertwined relationship between neurotic pride and self-contempt. understanding how a neurotic pride system underlies an appearance of self-contempt and low self-esteem. (Cooper, 112-13).

A simple buddhist named
loong

I the nothing, I the nothing spirit the all.

Hello Loong,

Wiki and Wikied are not words in my vocabulary

Words not in my vocabulary do not exist

Therefore Wiki and Wikied are not words.

Cheers and disengaging...

To Lestie,

You definitely have not understood,at all,,,,what this is all about.
Thank you for your agressive participation.

But you see, agressiveness does not affect me.

With compassion for those who suffer.
_/\_
a simple buddhist named
loong

To all
In french exists 2 words for pride ,one is :orgueuil: meaning pride ,like I AM, I,I, I, .Then there is the word :fierte:
meaning being proud of the graduation of one's daughter,proud of acheiving something.Proud for oneself ,not for others,which is the negative side of the word pride.

With Loving Kindness,
_/\_
a simple buddhist named
Loong.

Ok, so if you are going beyond the 'word' and into the spiritual meaning, the I, id, ego, does not exist when one becomes a part of the whole.

Pride in one's achievements is not conducive to reaching the point of fulfillment and humbleness -- to experience the rightness of the achievement is not pride, it is enlightenment.

My dear Phyllis,
35 years ago when I joined A.A. the word Pride:orgueuil: was the ennemy of humility.The word used for show-offs,the anti spiritual word of the time .One day someone comes up and takes pride out of the picture and puts the word/root EGO as the nemesis anyone on the path whatever it may be ,has to be rid off.

Like I asked you in my post # 755925,where in all your dictionnaries listed is Ego mentionned as being the villain,the
word to avoid.Again I repeat myselg ego means I or Self.What is bad in that ?

With loving kindness
a simple buddhist named
loong

Dear Loong,

Perhaps the confusion here is a lack of clarity. It is unclear to me what it is you are looking for as an answer or opinion from others. In your first post it is clear that in your opinion the word 'ego' does not exist. You expected rebuttals and got them, for the word 'ego' does in fact exist.

I will clarify my thoughts on the subject.

I see nothing bad about the words ego, I, or pride, if used in a positive way.

Pride has two meanings, one negative, one positive. On the positive side, pride refers to a satisfied sense of attachment toward one's own or another's choices and actions. One can also have pride towards a whole group of people and therefore becomes praise, independent self-reflection, or a feeling of belonging. Pride in one's country or military, or family, is not a bad thing.
Pride from Wikipedia

Pride can become bad if used as an inflated sense of one's personal status or accomplishments -- or an inflated ego.

Ego, I, id, self are not bad words, nor do they imply that the use of them is bad.

So, could you please clarify what it is you are looking for in a response to your posts?

Also, could you explain from what level you are coming from (ie: spiritual, religious, general as in appropriate language use, or ?).

This is an interesting subject, yet one that needs clarification so we, and others, can discuss it with validity in an amiable way.

To Phyllis,
since last nite I have been trying to find the words that will
make me understood.If we were on your porch with tea face to face,would be much easier.Here is what I thought of.
Let us clear the table ,if you do not mind,and start from my part to be clearer.
When we speak of pride ,you wrote:Pride can become bad if used as an inflated sense of one's personal status or accomplishments -- or an inflated ego.
As far as the word ego you wrote:Ego, I, id, self are not bad words, nor do they imply that the use of them is bad.
So why is it for about the last ten years instead of using false
pride people use the word ego i.e. It is his ego speaking,meaning ego as a bad word ,when in reality,the word used should be false pride. That is all I meant.

I really hope this time i am clearer.False pride was used in religion,spirituality,every day use,now all we see is Ego this ego that.Again this is all I meant.

With loving kindness
a fan of yours(i do not suck up to people,I say what I think.)

loong

To Phyllis,

By the way, in Buddhism ,I and Self, do not exist!

With friendship

loong

Loong, I think I am beginning to understand. Here are my thoughts:

Pride, as I noted, can be positive or negative. It depends on what one is proud about. I am very proud of my grandson who has done very well in school this year. It is a grandmother's right to be proud of her grandson.

As for pride, I have not noticed that people use the word ego in place of 'false pride'. The word ego has come in to use much more in the last, say ten years, because more people are becoming more spiritual since the early part of the 20th century. I do not see a connection between ego and false pride. Ego, when I and many of my spiritual friends, use it is meant to be the physical part of us, the part of us that is grounded to Earth. In other words, we have our ego (physical) and our true self (spirit). Since more people are more open now about their spirituality, the word ego is used quite often.

Someone may say something like "my ego is getting in the way of my spiritual growth" which means, "my physical self, or mind, is preventing me from getting in touch with my spirituality, my spirit's progress".

Pride and humility walk hand in hand. True humility needs no outside confirmation or approval. False humility is to openly claim you are less than you really are so that others will disagree and begin praising you. False pride is (correction needed here: concealing one's arrogance) claiming you are more than what you truly are.

There is a very good write-up about this at Pride And Humility by Serge Kahili King

I cannot copy all of the article to put here for that would be a copyright violation. If you could, please read the full article. The last two paragraphs of that article make a lot of sense to me and is what I would write about the subject.

Peace

Yet, not everyone is Buddhist. The I and Self do exist in many other religions and belief systems.

With friendship indeed.

Yes, Loong. Sitting and discussing face to face, over tea, is a much easier way to understand each other.

Dear,Dear,Phyllis,

When I entered the world of Buddhism ,until I understood what attman meant ,icould not beleive I had no I and self.It is about the only spiritual movement with such a belief.I have a thread about explaining that part of buddhism.I wish you could read it and see my side of the subject.

With great respect.

_/\_
Loong

Attman is the universal self !!

To all,

This is a subject that should bring people to the barricades.
2 persons emitted their opinion,I am overwelmed by the response
Hope to read you all .

Waiting for the traffic ,or at least one beleiver in spirituality.

_/\_
a simple Buddhist named
loong

Peace, Loong.

I can and do see your side of the subject. I have understanding of many religions and belief systems. I was raised Christian and as I became older began to study all religions because not all I believed is in the Christian doctrine and scripture. I found that Buddhism, Pagan, and Native American have much of what I believe in. I like Buddhism for its philosophy of life. I like Paganism for its love of Nature and magic of mysticism. I like the Lakhota belief system for it comes closest to my own beliefs. I am not sure then what anyone would say what my religion, or belief system is -- I just call it spiritual.

I accept people regardless of what their religion or belief system is and I do not try to make them believe my way. I honor and respect each person's right to worship/believe their own way.

I understand where you are coming from and I respect your way, for you. It seems to me that you want me to study your way and learn all I can about Buddhism. I have absolutely nothing against Buddhism, my son practices the Buddhism belief and teaches it. I learn all I want to learn about Buddhism from him and we have some great conversations about it.

Do you understand and respect my way, for me? I do not ask you to study Christianity, Paganism and Native American beliefs, for I believe you must be comfortable where you are and accept your belief system because it is right for you.

Let us each accept the fact that we have different belief systems, yet each are spiritual in our own ways, and each are comfortable where we are.

Peace

Phyllis makes a wonderful point here. We all have different belief systems and that is a good thing. The forum should be free of proselytizing - no one way is inherently more right than another way. No definition is naturally better than another one. People are allowed to define their own vocabulary in a way which makes the most sense to them.

To Lisa low Carb,

Plese cite a phrase where I proselytize,Please.

With respect
_/\_
a simple buddhist named
loong.
p.s. As I can see nobody understood my original statement.

I agree with Phyllis and Lisa. Each one of us has to be true to our own inner beings with our own versions of spirituality and beliefs for our happiness and peace, and also for our relationships with everything and everyone around us. We form our belief systems based on what resonates to be right and true within ourselves.

As long as what we believe results in being kind to others and embraces love, I feel that every person's belief system has value and should be respected. It is not necessary to try to change another person's belief system. Spirituality for each one of us is a personal and private thing, and we can rejoice in the differences. It's what makes us unique while sharing many similarities as human beings.

What Cassie said!

Thank you, Lisa. I have always believed in respecting the ways of others. Burt says it so simply and true: be and let be.

Cassie, you say it so beautifully. This forum has always been open to people of all religions, faiths, belief systems. I have always been very comfortable here discussing many things with friends. It is a place where all can come together in respect and friendship, share, learn, and grow ever more spiritually.

Jilly, I so agree with you. You are spot on!

To all,
Yesterday ,I wrote an e-mail to a member explaining that buddhism
does not search for new members.When Deanna left she wrote me an e-mail saying she was leaving Bella on Line but letting her account open.So I took it on myself to try to come up with real spiritual questions.All I got was misunderstanding ,accused of recruiting members for buddhism.
So like I told the person, I will not put a thread in the spirituality section anymore.

So I leave the threading to all of you,spiritually guided members.

Buddha once said ,Practice ,practice.look where it got me.

A simple buddhist named
llong

Nobody is attacking you, Loong.

The only thing I see in the recent posts on this thread is that even if we don't agree with each other, we all have personal beliefs that should be respected. Everyone is different, and what may work for one person may not work for someone else. We each have to be true to ourselves. If we all come together in love and understanding here then we are all welcome to express our opinions and insights, even if others do not agree.

When we post we agree to be respectful of others and to be respectful even if we disagree with another's view. Your posts are always welcome.

To Cassie,

Thank you.

Loong

Loong, please don't feel like that. Please keep posting. Some of us are just sensitive about how new or shy members may perceive their welcome here (due to past forum experiences). We don't want anyone to be afraid to post. Including you.

Personally I don't think you were recruiting. You are asking good questions. It just takes a while to get the balls rolling sometimes - this kind of communication is fraught with misunderstands sine we can't be face to face and see how kindly things might have been meant.

Jilly and Cassie are exactly right. Every person is welcome, and every person's opinion should be respected and encouraged. So we should avoid statements such as "These are my sources. What are yours?" Opinions should not need sources. Every person should be able to state what they feel, for whatever reason they may feel it. All opinions should be equally valid and appreciated.

We do have a new Spirituality editor - Debbie Grejdus - and she is the one responsible for making fresh threads and guiding the discussion. Soon she will be through initial training and taking on that task. I'm sure we will have some wonderful discussions going forward!

And just so you all know......Debbie Grejdus is my real name, so you know who I am already Thanks for the introduction, Lisa!

Debbie.....aka Cassie67

Debbie, a huge warm welcome to you as our new Spirituality editor. It is good to have you here. I so enjoy reading your posts.

Best wishes to you going forward.

Loong, If you quit posting then one of us will be absent from expression. You know that this is not the answer. My Buddhist friends are some of the most rock-solid people that I know. They have love and understanding that goes beyond mine at times when I get a little too severe on myself. They have the ability to bring back a balance when things seem a little to flighty or confused.

For me, I had to learn how to express things in posting in more of a seeking or questioning mode. I found for myself that I am not an expert poster as some of the more seasoned people are on here and had to learn how to post in a beckoning method instead of a "telling" method. Does that make sense?? I like you have a strong personality. Because I am a Taurus the Bull I must examine the content of what I speak or write as so many others are of a profoundly gentler nature than I am and I will not offend them. We don't ever mean to offend, it is just the nature of a strong person to express themself in that manner. It takes practice and patience. You are a good friend Loong!! dave

To Dave,
Thank you for your post.For the last 12 years ,i have been posting on various kinds of groups.You see I am used with pople that open up,discuss,tell whom they are.What they are,what their views are for real,like you said in your post .Here it seems that
everyone must be taken with velvet gloves.The last place I was for 6 to 7 years,was because the posts were getting heavy for gentle me.People do not know me .I am a gentle person trying to share his knowledge with others.But it does not work that way here.
Thank you for your loving kindness.
_/\_
loong
normand joly

Loong, If I may help with something here if you will allow me. I don't think that velvet gloves is the answer here either. These ladies are very deep thinkers and don't underestimate their ability to handle some down-right rough stuff in dealing with others on these spirituality sites. I think that we're all getting to know each other and that is paramount to communication. I feel that the reason we are low-key here is that in todays world we have enough pressure and division and we all need a place to come to relax in a trust with each other. Things can get heated yet we need to allow others to assist us when we might need some help.

The way that I feel is that I don't give a rip if my voice is heard here as much as just having a family of friends that I can count on when the chips are down. There are not a lot of places to go to today that is neutral ground for deeper expression.

You are most welcome here and we would certainly miss your input. Peace to you

Debbie, Congrats on becoming the new editor!!!! As open as you are on the topic of spirituality you will be SO excellent here!!! dave

Hi Debbie,

It's going to be interesting with what you come up with ! !!

Phyllis, Dave, and Burt.....thank you for your good wishes. I am no expert, but I am open to new things and also suggestions from you all for topics that we can discuss.

I appreciate your support and I will do my best for the Spirituality site and forum. For now it is training, training, training......LOL!

You will do just fine, Debbie. We have faith in you.

You should open a new thread to introduce yourself to everyone out there.

Isn't all that training fun?

Greetings, Loong.

Have you had any time to read through 'The Goddess' thread? There are a lot of interesting thoughts, opinions, and beliefs there and many of them differ from each other -- yet we all get along like a big family. Even with disagreements we come together in love and it is good to have you with us.

To Phyllis.

Thank you.

With respect
loong

W E L C O M E Cassie67! Welcome indeed.

Cheers

To Cassie 67,

Bravo,Bravo,You will do a great job.

With Loving Kingdeness

a simple buddhist named
loong

Dear Debbie -

You are a delightful member of our community and we are thrilled to have you as the guiding light for this topic area! The training time will fly by

We have a page in our forum guidelines that is specifically about posting with compassion. Interestingly, it was created initially because of posts in the Buddhism forum.

Here is the guideline page:

Posting with Compassion in the BellaOnline forums

This is definitely a guiding principle for these forums.

To all,

Doing some mind searching about the last few posts,regarding the fact that I always state that ,I am a Buddhist.
Found out ,that no one else defines her/his type of Spirituality,
they live. The word spirituality which includes thousands of ways of describing it.This with all the love I possess,why when someone writes a post,do they not ,identify their spirituality.There is no shame defining oneself,and especially
will help others know the writer better.

With Loving Kindness
_/\_
loong

Loong, I have stated on other threads that I've been raised Roman Catholic, and I attend Mass. I may not agree with everything in regards to this religion, but the fundamentals are there that I value. I take from it what resonates true within me, and I also believe in more than just God.

To me, spirituality is not entirely about what religion or higher powers you believe in. Yes, this is important, but so is the inner self with your own personal truths and values, your nontangible relationships with others, nature, and everything around you, your inner voice that gives you direction in life.....what moves you. It is what you cannot see that is spiritual, and that can encompass so many things, including the spirit world and the afterlife. Everyone has their own feelings and beliefs in that respect.

Spirituality in itself is very personal and does not have to be shared with anyone, but we welcome and share ideas here, and we share what is comfortable for us to discuss. Not everyone will reveal themselves but instead come here to learn about new ideas and beliefs to help them along their own spiritual path. We respect all who come to learn and share.

So if what you are asking is what religion we believe in, that would easier to answer if someone wants to reveal that about themselves, but it's not necessary information in order to have spiritual conversations. Some people have no religion at all, per se, but they are very spiritual people.

Greetings Loong.

I so agree with Debbie about everyone stating their religion or belief system. It is not really necessary to state this personal area of our lives that often.

We all have, over time, discussed our own belief systems. Some of us have been here for years and have gotten to know each other well, so we do not continually state our personal faith.

I made a suggestion that if one reads through the Goddess thread, it will become more clear as to what each person believes and where they are coming from in a spiritual sense.

Because you are fairly new to BellaOnline it is natural for you to want to learn all about those you have contact with. It is to your advantage to take the time to read through other threads here in the Spirituality forum. The Goddess thread was started about five years ago, maybe longer, I do not remember right now, but a long, long time ago. The thread is not all about a Goddess, it is about people, us, your friends, and what each of us believe and how we got to this point in life.

It would be easier for you to explore past threads to learn more about your new friends here than it is for everyone to start all over with discussing our lives and beliefs.

I hope this helps you to go forward with more knowledge about everyone here.

Have a great day.

Dear Debbie,
First congtats.Second you wrote:So if what you are asking is what religion we believe in, that would easier to answer if someone wants to reveal that about themselves, but it's not necessary information in order to have spiritual conversations. Some people have no religion at all, per se, but they are very spiritual people.

Loong's comment: I never asked what religion people are in,what i referred to identifying the bases of one's spirituality.

Phyllis just wrote me.Do not ,please forget that I am pretty new here,and everywhere I went before,people would identify their roots.

I understand very well,and in any other place that i will go,I will identify myself simply by loong,except in Buddhism.

Hope that suites you fine ,and others also.
loong

Loong.....I did say "If" what you are asking is what religion we believe in, because I was not sure what exactly you were asking. Thank you for clarifying that.

Even so, not everyone will want to disclose what resonates spiritually within themselves. It is a personal thing. If you wanted to share this information about yourself, you've been welcome to and we respect you for it.

I believe in God, but also the Great Mother, who is often referred to as a goddess in Her own right, among many other natural and mystical things. Some of it is religion but some of it is not. Everyone's spirituality is personal and can be very complex. Some people will want to share all that they believe, some will share some of what they believe, and some will choose not to share their beliefs at all but will join in some very interesting conversations here. I don't really think it matters how much of themselves they want to share as long as they come here with acceptance and respect for all belief systems, whatever that entails.

We welcome your opinion as well, and if you want to refer to yourself as Buddhist or not is entirely up to you. It makes no difference, as we all come here in peace, and you are respected as a valued member of our community.

Cassie - so very exciting you have joined our editor family! I am so happy you've taken this step.

I guess i have to call you Debbie now, instead of using the moniker of your sweet horse?

Jilly.....for a time my beloved horse's name suited me well when I wanted to stay anonymous. Now I have to own up to who I really am if I want to write articles....LOL!

I hope I will bring some value and enlightenment to the Spirituality site and forum, as well as encouraging all to post their ideas. Thanks for the warm welcome, Jilly!

I AM a Christian Mystic

To Burt B.

Hello friend,just wikied Christian Mysticism and here is a summary of what was written:Christian mysticism From Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJump to: navigation, search
Union with Christ is the purpose of Christian mysticism.Christian mysticism refers to the development of mystical practices and theory within Christianity. It has often been connected to mystical theology, especially in the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox traditions. The attributes and means by which Christian mysticism is studied and practiced are varied and range from ecstatic visions of the soul's mystical union with God to simple prayerful contemplation of Holy Scripture (i.e., Lectio Divina). This article addresses the practice of the inner, spiritual life within the Christian tradition.......
After reading the full article ,there were great men in that
group,who were your favorite ,and from what era.?
I thank you for helping me find a branch that never knew existed.

Friend to friend
loong

That's cool, Burt. I also didn't really think there might be a branch like that.

There is a book I have been wanting to read called "The Christian Mystery: From Pagan Myth to Christian Mysticism" by Louis Bouyer.

It seems very interesting to me since I have many Pagan beliefs within my own belief system and was raised Christian. If anyone has read that book, I would like to see a thread in this forum about the subject.

Thank you, Burt for bringing this up.