BellaOnline Forums Religion and Spirituality Bible Basics Did adam and eves kids have sex with each other?

You're asking the wrong people....
None of us is a scientist, nor an archeologist, nor an historian... so we cannot supply you with these answers....

There are experts on both sides of the fence who will argue both cases with as much coviction and faith in their respective 'proofs'....

But any belief of a system which is primarily based on having faith in a flawed document, to my mind is neither sound nor reliable.

With all the very best will in the world, I put muy faith into scientific research, carbon dating and common sense.

Thank you.

Nice talking to you.

Wow, I have been away for a few days!

(Welcome Jim.)
I'm one of those that believes that the bible and science are not mutually exclusive of each other.

Evolution can be taken at many levels - and I do believe man has "evolved" to an extent. From some reading that I've done it would appear that mankind has grown taller and more muscular over the years. Look at all of the Olympic records that keep being broken - it would not be possible if man were not getting "better".

The same goes for all animals; they adapt or evolve to ensure survival. The same for viruses and bacteria (which is why we have the problem with antibiotics that we do! Sorry, sore subject of mine from the Asthma page, LOL)

Now, do I believe that man once was swimming in the ocean and crawled up onto land to become a monkey then into homosapien? NO. That's not adaptation, that is a complete metamorphosis.

I have also stated (somewhere long, long ago) that I don't disagree with the big bang theory either. However no scientist has any reason why it occured. Could that not have been the way God chose to start our solar system? I don't know, and neither does anyone else.

I have never seen anything in science to disprove God. But neither will I ever see proof of Him, because all the proof has already been supplied - it is up to us to choose whether to believe in it or not. That's where faith comes in - and that is the hingepoint of Christianity - whichever denomination we are speaking of.

Faith and free will... we all have choices.

I'm replying now on this new area of subject, as commented above, by Alexandra:
People who accept theories that are other than Biblical are also putting faith in "flawed documents".
How do you determine if the Bible is flawed? Do you determine this because you believe it is? What document does contain absolute truth, the documents of Buddah?
People comment on theories that are other than Biblical all the time (like in the preceeding posts), who are not archeologists, scientists or historians. How are they able to do this (Christians included), when they are none of these?
The majority of the time people accept what they WISH TO BELIEVE and has nothing to do with proof.
Why do I accept the Bible? I accept it foremost because it bears witness with my deepest self (heart). I also accept it because of its fulfillment of hundreds of precise prophecies. The claim that there are contradictions in the Bible, is a wish and not a claim with any substance.
I tried to find contradictions in it, as an atheist,in my youth but instead I accepted its truth and was profoundly changed. Some call it a religious experience, I call it eternal life but I cannot, even with every waking second of my life, convince someone else that what I experience is true and real. I can only share my beliefs and they can accept or reject based on what they search out for their selves.
We get caught up in "proving" things when in reality even proof itself is not enough for most people. People resist what they don't want to believe and bend over backwards to believe what they do want to believe.
Bottom line; You're gonna believe what you want to believe but that does not take away from the fact that there is ONLY ONE TRUTH for every aspect that exists.
My choice is the Bible, as God's Word and truth. Everyone comes to their own decision. I share what I believe to be truth that I also believe brings eternal life, people then search it out and accept or reject. My responsibility, is sharing what I believe is God's Word, God and that person will have to take it from there.
Michelle, have you read my article Jenna has featured, having to do with the age of the earth and fall of Lucifer?

No, but I will have to do so!

I've been a bit overwhelmed with a family issue this week, and so haven't been on top of my game I'm afraid. <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

I'll be back when I've had a chance to look at it! <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Jim has written an excellent article and submitted it to me for publishing on the Bible Basics site. Hehas also posted on another thread for questions about his article...I was so awed by it that it is running live on the site right now. I think everyone should go read it, both part 1 and part 2.

yes, maybe
Ii am harsh and blunt and too friendly with the edit button, but I feel that we should all just be nice. There are people who come in and read all the time without posting and sometimes what we write can be read the wrong way. Even though I know you all are involved in a wonderful and very well thought out debate ( which I am loving, by the way) I felt that the certain way the comment was posted needed to be re-worded.

It was not an attack on anyone individually. I won't do that. But just remember that there are other people who read this string and they may not understand...

please continue with the discussion...

PS If the poster wants to go back and reword her particular post in a more reader-friendly way she is absolutly welcome to do so. <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

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Actually, one of the first Sutras taught by the Buddha was the Kalama Sutra, which strongly encourages Students of Life and 'Seekers of Truth' to absolutely strip every lesson to shreds and to scrutinise anything they learn with clarity and precision, and to further question, re-question, and if necessary, question again, before accepting anything as an infallible Truth. And he held up his teachings, first and foremost, to this scrutiny before anything else....
Whilst I wish to be extremely respectful to my Christian friends here, speaking purely from a personal and singular point of View, the Bible did not stand up to my scrutiny, whereas everything I have learnt through Buddhism has yet to throw shadows of Doubt across my Field of Logic.....



If the majority of people accept what they WISH to believe, then they are not using the intelligence and discernment they were born with...
I am repeating myself...I have nothing but admiration for those who accept the Word of God into their hearts, be it via the Bible, the Qu'ran or through the Torah....
But the heart is the seat of emotion, and the Mind is the seat of Logic.



This part, I cannot dispute, providing you have done with your chosen scripture what I have done with mine... Stripped it to its absolute bare minimum essentials, line by line, scrap by scrap, and found every single syllable to be diamond-cut clear and fundamentally true....



You are generalising strongly here.... people may be more intelligent, more discerning and more skeptical than you realise. 'People' now, more than at any other time in the percievable History of Man, are seeking for something stable and immovable upon which they can rely.... people from all walks of Life want to find a rock for their anchor... This is why there has been such a surge of Spirituality and New-age thinking in recent years. I am not for one moment attempting to indicate that it's all "good" or commendable, but more and more people are looking for something upon which to rely.




According to Buddhism, there are Two levels of Truth:
Relative and Absolute.... And one must first understand, accept and embrace the first, before being able to do the same with the second....but the two are inextricably linked...



The key word here, the absolute crux of your discussion, is the word 'CHOICE'. You have chosen to believe and accept the Bible as the unshakable word of God, and for this, I heartily commend you and deeply respect and honour your Belief and Faith.
Again, simply from my own personal and individual perspective, I subjected it to scrutiny, and along the way, discovered Buddhism. But I did not 'choose' Buddhism because I had faith in its teachings, or believed what the Buddha taught is true... I moved to Buddhism because, quite simply, there is nothing within its teachings that can be disputed, questioned or held up to be ambiguous....

I will at this point emphasise something encouraged throughout Buddhist teachings, and state that my above responses have come about through my own personal study and appreciation of the Buddha's teachings...
Aach one must absorb their personal scriptures for themselves, and accept or reject the lesson therein.... I do not claim to speak for, or to represent other Buddhists. I would never say 'Buddhists think' or 'As Buddhists, we all'....Because, as a Buddhist, I am encouraged to Accept only that which will enable ME to see Truth face to face.

I also would like to take this opportunity of thanking the forum Moderator for being open and caring enough to permit this discussion to continue.
You all have my gratitude and respect for being so generous.

JimLow, pleasure discussing with you. You are articulate and considerate, as are the rest of the folks in here.

Now, 10% of me wanted to cry foul when you immediately resorted to the Bible is the Word of God and the that's all I need argument. Did not God make you a reasoning, intelligent being? Isn't is the responsibility of intelligent people to challenge authority?

Did not Christ himself question the Jewish rabbi's interpretation of scripture and the way they did things (like charging money to get into the temple)? His very example was to challenge authority and do what was right, what feels right in our heart, and not take the words of "experts" on God.

However, I totally agree with you that some things are beyond words to even express. Such as rapture. Enlightenment. The true nature of the creator.

This is why the Buddha held up a flower as one sermon, without mentioning a word.

The greatest things can only be felt, and can never be explained. Discussion and splitting hairs (your semantics reference) can't really get us to any end but discussion for the sake of it. (And I'll never forgive Bill Clinton for the 'that depends what 'is' is' defense.)

But I love discussion. I love being a thinking, rational, logically-induced being. It's fun. However, at the end of the day I'm going to go with my gut feeling, just as you.

To Alexandra,

I did not mean to imply that Buddhists never accepted evolution. Only that they were the first to state it was not incompatible with a belief in a creator.

It's refreshing to find someone who carefully reads my words and can find the flaws in my arguments and is not afraid to point them out to me. Such is message board posting that I go quickly and don't spend time to edit a spare word, such as "even" in my post, which would have removed the implication that they were against evolution at the get-go.

Big bang: Vishnu sleeps in the pool of cosmic consciousness and he opens his eyes and closes his eyes and the universe is created and destroyed. And the world is his dream.

I also note that pictures rendered of the entire universe seem to resemble a lotus flower. To my mind anyway. The Buddhists I believe also noted this.