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Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199432
07/06/05 10:28 PM
07/06/05 10:28 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,254
Farmington, NH
Wendy Tall One Offline
Chipmunk
Wendy Tall One  Offline
Chipmunk
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,254
Farmington, NH
Yes, Jenna, the easter bunny, tannebaum, halloween (followed by the very christian READ :catholic: All Saints Day), ground hogs day (catholic candlemas), and I'm sure many others are all rooted in some sort of paganism. In order to bring about conformity and such those traditions were absorbed into the faith to make it easier to make the pagans believers.
I will say that my mild disdain for born agains is having what used to be a very good friend of mine badger me constantly about accepting the lord and savior into my life etc etc. I could prattle on...but she got to be too much about it. What she didnt know is that I was raised in the church went to sunday school for years as well as VBS. And that my gram & mom were sunday school teachers for a good 50+ years combined.
Hence why I like it here..."most" people dont assume you must be saved. However kat, like jenna said you must give respect to get it...I advise against coming into any forum with guns ablaze blasting another persons belief system.


per aspera ad astra: Through rough ways to the stars...

Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199433
07/07/05 01:38 AM
07/07/05 01:38 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 325
Kat1980 Offline OP
Shark
Kat1980  Offline OP
Shark
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 325
I am sorry my mistake. I thought this was a Spirituality forum not a Christianity forum. Perhaps the name should be changed to Christianity if that is the case.

Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199434
07/07/05 02:29 AM
07/07/05 02:29 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
musicalmom Offline
Gecko
musicalmom  Offline
Gecko
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
I think the mistake was mine. I saw the title Spirituality vs Religion and i thought it was a debate! I love debates, I used to be on the debate team in college, add that to the fact that i have been STARVED for adult conversation for about the past year (i never knew there were websites like this, before I found this place, this is great!), and the fact that i am very excited about my faith and well....
picture a hyperactive pomeranian that just drank a coke!
Buddy, I was ready to debate! I really wan't trying to convert anyone, I just wanted you (Kat) to cede a point to me. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> Then I got carried away. <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Maybe next time write Poem: Spirituality vs Religion. Cause when I see that "vs" I'm comin out with the boxin gloves on!

Seriously, I hope we can all put this behind us, and realize where our boundaries are. I'm the newbie, oh excuse me I'm now an official amoeba, so I guess i needed the map the most.

Sincere apologies all around ladies.
Michelle


Michelle Taylor
Why me? What did I do to deserve this?
(go on, ask)
Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199435
07/09/05 02:29 AM
07/09/05 02:29 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,254
Farmington, NH
Wendy Tall One Offline
Chipmunk
Wendy Tall One  Offline
Chipmunk
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,254
Farmington, NH
When reading other peoples posta may I repeat a mantra that we use at work ALL the time....'Slow down, nice & easy' course there are accompany-ing hand gestures and voice alterations but I wont go into that...in short, what i mean is read the a post...if it upsets you dont reply..sit on it and think about what they are saying then post later int he afternoon or even the next day. rather than starting a scathing reply loaded to the brim with preaching and sarcasm.


per aspera ad astra: Through rough ways to the stars...

Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199436
07/09/05 05:16 AM
07/09/05 05:16 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
musicalmom Offline
Gecko
musicalmom  Offline
Gecko
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
Preaching I'll definitely admit to, I didn't realize I was terribly sarcastic, though.

Hmmmmmmm, better go sit on my hands a while. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


Michelle Taylor
Why me? What did I do to deserve this?
(go on, ask)
Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199437
07/09/05 06:20 AM
07/09/05 06:20 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 325
Kat1980 Offline OP
Shark
Kat1980  Offline OP
Shark
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 325
Musicalmom there is no need for an apology. I think all of this is just a misunderstanding. You seem like a very nice person and I don't want any animosity between us.

Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199438
07/09/05 03:53 PM
07/09/05 03:53 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
musicalmom Offline
Gecko
musicalmom  Offline
Gecko
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
Kat, you may change your mind about me when you read my postings in the low carb forum!

We'll just say I had a bad week last week. <img src="/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> And I'll go ahead and apologize again. <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />


Michelle Taylor
Why me? What did I do to deserve this?
(go on, ask)
Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199439
07/13/05 02:03 PM
07/13/05 02:03 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,698
USA
JanetBoyer Offline
Zebra
JanetBoyer  Offline
Zebra
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,698
USA
I came across a neat quote today by Marilyn Ferguson:

Spirituality is a kind of virgin wisdom, a knowing that comes prior to experience.

Religion, IMO, comes after teaching and indocrination.

Often, in order to re-connect with our spirits and the Divine, we need to shed the teachings of pastors, parents, and books--if we dare to do so. I offer that most "religious belief" has come from the outside, and isn't even borne out of personal experience.

That's one of the reasons I like Jesus so much: he came to sever the reliance on doctrine and man's ideas about God through direct experience, leading others back to themselves to find the "kingdom of God within".

Unfortunately, should Jesus walk the Earth today, he wouldn't recognize his teachings and would likely be stoned by his own "followers".

Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199440
07/13/05 02:30 PM
07/13/05 02:30 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
musicalmom Offline
Gecko
musicalmom  Offline
Gecko
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 435
Flowery Branch, Georgia
Quote:

That's one of the reasons I like Jesus so much: he came to sever the reliance on doctrine and man's ideas about God through direct experience, leading others back to themselves to find the "kingdom of God within".

Unfortunately, should Jesus walk the Earth today, he wouldn't recognize his teachings and would likely be stoned by his own "followers".


I'm goin to hit these in backwards order (I'm still not very good at using all the neat tool on here yet, sorry)

I struggle, a lot, with whether I am following Jesus' teachings, which basically boil down to; love they neighbor & lead by serving. You're right, he wouldn't recognize that in a lot of His churches today. We are like the early Jews, expecting Messiah to come in glorious splendor, instead of peaceful comfort.

But I don't believe He meant for us to find the kingdom of God within. I believe we are to ask Him into our hearts and then the Holy Spirit comes to reside in us. Until we do that we are separated from God, there isn't any way for us to find Him within. <img src="/images/graemlins/angel.gif" alt="" />


Michelle Taylor
Why me? What did I do to deserve this?
(go on, ask)
Re: Spirtuality vs Religion #199441
07/13/05 02:51 PM
07/13/05 02:51 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,698
USA
JanetBoyer Offline
Zebra
JanetBoyer  Offline
Zebra
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,698
USA
Well, traditional Christianity may teach that you can't experience God without asking him to come "inside". The funny thing is the Bible also says that "no one can come to the Father except the Holy Spirit draws him." So does that mean that only those specially chosen by God can even get past the first step of being "drawn" before the second step of "accept"?

I don't think so.

I do agree that many Christians are like the early Jews in that they are expecting the Messiah to come with vengeance towards 'unbelievers' and then evacuate the 'believers' out of the Earth.

Quote:
But I don't believe He meant for us to find the kingdom of God within.


That's what the religious leaders of the day thought, too, which is why they stoned Jesus. The idea that you can find the kingdom of God within through a direct experience with the Divine is very dangerous to religion. It's also very dangerous to the human ego that has built up a fortress based on teachings that say God is "out there", only accessible by "chosen ones".

If Jesus didn't mean for us to find the Kindgom within, then why did he say:

"Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, 'The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!' For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you." Luke 17:20-21

An interesting treatment of the kingdom of God within:

http://www.gnostic-jesus.com/

Last edited by Janet_Boyer; 07/13/05 05:29 PM.
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