BellaOnline Forums Religion and Spirituality Buddhism Understanding our Mind

Dear Lisa,

I beleive that any change is in some way difficult.
Becoming one's true self ,I beleive is the hardest.

Loong

In a few days I will retake my vows.

To all or none

Again from TNH.

Habit energy is an important term in Buddhist psychology.Our seeds carry the habit énergies of thousand of years.The Sanskrit term for habit energy,is Vasana,means "to permeate ,"to impregnate.Because of habit energies WE ARE NOT ABLE to perceive things as they TRULY are.We interpret everything we see or hear in terms of our habit energy.If you crumble a sheet of paper ,it
is difficult to make it flat again .It has the the habit energy of being crumpled.We are the same.

loong's comment: I will go farther by saying that what is the true seed has been altered through eons and with the contacts we had ,had with it,in this life.

loong
Part of the Oneness

To all or none,

We have to recognize,embrace,and transform our negative habit energies and train ourselves,to have more positive habit energies.

These positives habits need to be cultivated,because our negative habits always push us to do and say things that bring suffering to ourselves and others.
Loong part of the Oneness.

We will now enter chapter 8 ,Field of Perception.

Manifestations from Store Consciousness
Can be perceived directly in the mode of things in themselves,
as representations,or as mere images.
All are included in The eighteen elements of being.
In another post ,I will explain what are the eighteen elements
of being.

Loong son of the Universe

To all or none,

A few moments ago ,I had total proof of the workings of store
consciousness.

I am preparing to go to court for the prelemilary hearing of one
of the 2 persons that stabbed me in April /13.

Going to the Big city and to court ,I bought a suit ,shirt and tie.When I put the necktie around my neck I made the knot at lightning speed as if I made one yesterday .

I had not made a knot in over25 years.

So Store consciousness does not forget.

Loong
son of the Universe

But this is muscle memory, no? I guess that could be considered part of store consciousness, but I think it is really more about the imprinting of emotional patterns and perceptual frameworks...

Dear Lisa,
So if you think it is more about the imprinting of emotional patterns and per ceptual frameworks,from where do these two
Originate from?

Loong
Mahayana Buddhist

It comes from all of our experiences, in this life and others, although some make more of an impression than others. But I am not sure something like being able to tie a tie-knot or ride a bicycle after many years of not doing so is really the same thing, because that is more muscle memory - our body remembering how to do something. That is what I was responding to in your post. At least in the system that I learned (and there are more than one classification so perhaps the one I learned is different from TNH's), bodily memories such as this are a different category than storehouse consciousness.

In the system I learned, storehouse consciousness has more do with karmic patterns - default reactions, triggers, and ways of perceiving that are so subconscious it can take many years of practice to really see them operating within ourselves. A default of judgement for example, or fear.

Dear Lisa,

Everything comes from somewhere.Muscle memory has to be stored somewhere!Just wikied Muscle memory,here is what is written:
In the early stages of empirical research of motor memory Edward Thorndike, a leading pioneer in the study of motor memory, was among the first to acknowledge learning can occur without conscious awareness.[6] One of the earliest and most notable studies regarding the retention of motor skills was by Hill, Rejall, and Thorndike, who showed savings in relearning typing skills after a 25 year period with no practice.[2] Findings related to the retention of learned motor skills have been continuously replicated in studies, suggesting that through subsequent practice, motor learning is stored in the brain as memory. This is why performing skills such as riding a bike or driving a car are effortlessly and 'subconsciously' executed, even if someone had not performed these skills in a long period of time.[2].

As you can see ,the scientist refers to Subconsciouly.I see store concsiousness as the subconscious.
Since I started reading the book by TNH ,In my mind the term used ,store consciousness ,is his or Buddhism way of calling the subconscious.

With respect
loong

But doesn't TNH distinguish between the different manas, with the physical ones a different type than store consciousness? That is the model I am most used to.

Of course as you know, I don't really think it matters that much. I view all of the Buddhist psychological and philosophical models as means to an end. They are not about discovering 'the truth'. They are upaya, or skillful means - models for our mind to grasp that support practice. So if viewing muscle memory in this way has caused something to 'click' for you in terms of your own understanding about how your own mind works, then that is what matters.