BellaOnline Forums Religion and Spirituality Atheist Helen Keller and Atheism

Helen Keller's birthday was just celebrated, and I think it's intriguing to remember one of her most famous quotes:

"There is so much in the Bible against which every instinct of my being rebels, so much so that I regret the necessity which has compelled me to read it through from beginning to end."

It's an intriguing thought. I do believe we should all read the Bible from beginning to end, as it forms the basis of so much in society. The only way to have an engaged discussion on any topic thoroughly is to understand it completely first.

If you are an atheist, have you read the Bible? Or do you rely on the thoughts of others on it? Have you only read sections? Why or why not?

Dear Francine -

That's an interesting thought, about church attendance in different locations. I'll make a separate thread about it!

On this topic, I do think that it's important for all adults to read the Bible, whether they believe in it or not. The document is integral for many of our world's populations. To understand what basis they have for their point of view is key.

In terms of being an atheist I think it's doubly important to have read it, for the reasons you mentioned. With the majority of the world believing in the Bible it's important to know what it says, if one is then going to say one does not believe in it.

That being said, I'm not sure it's "necessary" to read it in order to be an atheist, because the Bible is just one view of God. There are many views of God. An atheist is saying "I believe in no supernatural overseeing force at all" - and they can do that without having to read about particular versions of them. A person can feel there are no supernatural all-powerful beings without reading specific stories of them.

So from a belief point of view I don't see it as necessary. But from an adult-living-in-a-modern-world point of view, I would find it absolutely critical.

Dear Francine -

Oh, absolutely, I agree that there are large swaths of people who do not believe in the Bible from end to end. Still, I think it would be fair to say, for example, that most people who are born and live in the US are raised and "indoctrinated" in the culture as it exists here. They often don't even realize that they are seeing the world through the filter of their upbringing. And much of the culture of the US has its initial foundations in Biblical points of view. Do not kill. Listen to your parents. That sort of thing.

When an image is portrayed of a woman and an apple, a whole "background story" comes to mind. When an image shows a large boat full of animals, the whole "background story" comes to mind. So those are part of the overall culture, and not just of people who are Catholic and go to church weekly.

I believe this would be true for many countries. Let's say many people in France do not go to church. I would believe that most of them, being raised in France, having gone through the French school system, having been raised watching French TV, still get a certain set of messages and ideas embedded in their brains that they simply take as "normal".

In my various discussions on the web over the years people often say "My parents raised me to know right from wrong" or "I just know it". Much of that comes down to the way we were indoctrinated as youth. It is nearly impossible (if not fully impossible) to completely shake that off, even if it we give it our absolute, full attention as adults. That wiring was made to our brains when it was still unformed. And that wiring was laid on top of the evolutionary instincts that study after study shows are incredibly powerful. Show a guy photos of women, with some in red frames, and the guys tend to go for the woman in the red frame. Show them women walking by, some in a red dress, and they tend to go for the red dress. Some things are just at such a base level in our brain that we can barely "see it".

So, in terms of the Bible, I think that it has interwoven in so many cultures for so many years that we might not even realize the influence it has. We almost take those subtle hints for granted. We just think they "are". That's part of why I feel it's so important we all read it and know what it says, to be more aware of that.

Dear Francine -

Absolutely, the beauty of the internet is that we can discuss a variety of views. If we all had the same view the discussion would be fairly boring.

Me: I believe X.

You: I believe X.

Me: It's nice that you believe X.

You: It's nice that you too believe X.



So with that being said, I would gently disagree with the thought that any person brought up in Western culture is not impacted by the thoughts of the Bible. All modern Western governments are founded based on the general principles espoused in it. Even people who did not read the Bible are living a life based on the overall guidelines. Yes, certainly, people in Western cultures then take those principles for granted! They think of them as natural and normal.

A study of civilizations around the world, and over the years, shows just how immensely varied and wide-ranging the actual belief systems have been on our earth. The ones in Western culture in modern times are an extremely narrow slice of the beliefs people have held. Western culture is not innately better (or worse) than any other culture.

For example, what really are "good manners"? Good manners are what a specific culture defines as the proper mode of behavior. Some cultures include berating those of a lesser caste. Some cultures include bludgeoning those who show even a tiny amount of disrespect. Some involve strict lines of "respect" between different groups of people. Some involve kids being treated as little gods. Some involve kids being silent and barely seen and being deferential to adults. Good manners varies wildly from culture to culture. There is no single standard.

So I think to start from the standpoint that there is one general standard of behavior, and that it coincides with the culture one has grown up in, might be a view to explore further.

In terms of this thread, I think it's quite challenging to separate the influence of the Bible from existing modern Western cultures. When one compares a Western country's mode of conduct from, say, an Asian country's mode of conduct, in a variety of spheres, the differences can be fairly intriguing. And when one goes back in time, the differences become even more distinct.

Dear Francine -

Oh absolutely I agree that Western cultures aren't 100% Biblically driven. There are all sorts of other influences that poke in there. Still, I think the Bible has a heavy hand in many areas of these cultures. Just look at the English Reformation and the massive impact it had on England. Look at how the Huguenots were driven out of France, then returned, then got driven out again. Martin Luther had a substantial impact on Germany. Now imagine that when Christ was around that he was thought of as "just another loony prophet" and no Bibles were written after his death. Imagine how differently the histories of all those countries - and the evolutions of their cultures - would have been.

I would gently disagree that, for example, treating others with respect, is a foundation of every culture. I understand that for some cultures it seems an absolute given that this is true. Still, for many cultures, caste systems are an absolute given. A person treats others based on their caste. They show zero respect for people of the lowest caste. They show enormous respect for those of a higher caste. So treating someone without condescension isn't a global cultural standard. For a number of cultures, it all depends on someone's parents.

This can happen in insidious ways that we don't consider. I think that people in countries with royalty often still treat those royals with more respect merely because of the caste they were born in. Their mere fact of birth caste influences how people perceive them.