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I am not completely saying that. There is a certain portion of society that is poor and eats out frequently, such as some college students and certain working class poor groups, that will NEED to eat out and won't really be able to pay a 15-20% tip.
Restaurants located in areas that they are frequented by these groups know who they are. These groups shouldn't be held to the same tipping standard as the rest of us.
There was a restaurant in Eugene, Or that had an all you can eat spaghetti night once a week for $3. They brought in a ton of people, including college students who couldn't leave a tip equal to the service they received (the percentage worked out in this rare case.)
The study in Oregon that stopped the restaurant tax showed this pretty clearly. I tried to find it so I could post it here, but I didn't see it anywhere.
For other folks, for whom eating out is a choice and a luxury, we should tip reasonably well. Even if we are poor, we are often able to come up with a stable eating plan and food storage in our homes.
If someone falls into the poor eating out group, then it would be best to take Phyllis' and the other suggestion to leave kind thoughts and a blessing.


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I truly hope I do not upset the apple cart here, Jilly. I believe, as I said, that leaving a pleasant note of gratitude and kind thoughts is a nice gesture if one cannot afford a tip.

Personally, I have never believed that tipping should ever be expected. Tipping, originally, was done as a gesture of thanks for good food, good service, and a pleasurable time. It was a form of reward and thanks.

Service people, like waiters and waitresses, are hired to do a specific service and (forgive me if I upset anyone) should not expect a tip. I agree it is nice to tip, but it should not be expected.

Everyone, poor or not, deserves to treat themselves to a special evening or other entertainment once in a while and should not have to tip at all. A very pleasant "thank you" and praise is the proper thing to do if one is pleased with the food and service yet cannot afford a tip.

I raised my kids on my own and had to make many long road trips over the years with my two little ones. Sometimes, I only had enough money for gas for the car and to stop and eat when we got hungry. I could not afford to give money (that my kids needed for nourishment and possible emergencies) as a tip to anyone.

I have had service jobs, including waitress, and never expected a tip. When I did get a tip it was very much appreciated, but never expected or demanded.

I think the rules and expectations should be changed and that the management of the establishment should be responsible for tipping the employees of said establishment. Any thoughts on that?


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These are excellent comments! I am keeping my opinionated opinions out of this for now, as I love this discussion and don't want to take it over.

What about tipping non-restaurant wait staff? Haircutters, hair colorists, pedicurists, pizza delivery boys and bartenders?

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Non-restaurant staff - I think it is more culturally acceptable to not tip. I think all of the salons where I live are full-service -there is no ten dollar pro haircut. I think they start out at $28. The cost of haircuts here is part of why I learned home haircutting. hairdressers here are well paid, and do not rely on tips to make up part of their income. Tips really are a complement to a hair stylist. Many poor people don't know how to cut their own hair.
I think bartender service would be more of a luxury for anyone. At least around here it is easy to get someone to buy you a drink if you can't afford one, and they pick up the tip. So even the poor can get a drink out once in awhile. That is local culture, I am curious what others have to say.
Pizza delivery service is service dependent. I once had a pizza delivery person show up drunk, she barged into my apartment, knocked stuff over, and scared the daylights out of me. then my neighbor came over and said that she had first barged into my neighbors place without knocking. No tip, and a few phone calls to her employer and the police were made. Locally, delivery drivers are paid above minimum wage, and are not dependent on tips.
Locally, bar tending and restaurant waitstaff rely on tips to make a livable (or even better wage). The other services like them, but aren't reliant on them. Being poor can change the tipping rules at restaurants, but good service is what drives a tip for anyone in the other services.
Curious to hear what others have to say - I do believe that it could be very different in other regions of the country, and especially throughout the world.

and as for Phyllis' suggestion - management tipping out or coming up with service/customer increase bonuses could be a much more socially equitable way to level out the pay issue of service oriented jobs. I like the concept!


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Whether it is for a sit-down restaurant or the hairdresser, I either plan to tip or I just don't go at all if I can't swing it. A lot of people in the service industry make ends meet by their tips. Often their base pay is not all that much, and they work hard like everyone else to make a living.


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I can see this is somewhat of a sensitive issue. I lean on the 'not my job to tip someone' side. I see a tip as a bonus for good service, not an entitlement.

I think I like Phyllis' idea to have management pay people their own servers' tipping wage. It's not my job to support servers. No one tips me for my work, and i actually went to college for it. I've never made more than 10k in a year, so i have no sympathy for service professions. I struggle, they struggle; it's all choices.

It's not a comes around, goes around thing for me, since no one tips me and i live far below the poverty line. I also can't ever pay my student loans - college was an utter waste for me financially (intellectually is another story).

I think for me it came to a head when i was working as a bartender. I'd pour a beer and get a dollar. I'd pour another beer and get a dollar. WOW, i thought, what craziness is this? Why did i even bother going to school? I could get rich just pouring beer, without needing a lick of education. I'd come home with $70 cash in my pockets for less work than anything else i'd done.

Since I am not motivated by money i don't tend any more bars, but really, it's a GREAT way to get cash for unschooled efforts.

And if you are someone who is good with people, (I am not) I feel the same way about waiting tables.

I don't know the deal with hairdressers. I don't want to tip them as i think haircoloring and cutting is hugely overpriced, but i feel massively guilty if I don't. Yet i know a friend who just blessedly doesn't tip hairdressers. I'd love to not care if they hate me and be like that.

For me, tipping is entirely about guilt and I hate being in that position.

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Having worked at a payroll company for 13 years, prior to my current job - though each state has different laws, there are minimum wage tip laws that allow restaurants to pay a couple of dollars below minimum wage, because the tips will bring them up to the federal minimum wage, but I to find it very difficult to tip for bad service.


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I don't tip for bad service and I don't tip out of guilt. I tip because I want to, and if I can't do that for great service then I will stay home until I can afford to do it. It may just be a social rule at this point to tip in certain circumstances, and maybe it is optional, but I like doing it when I feel that I have been treated well.

At this point in my life I can't afford luxuries anyway, so the issue of tipping almost never comes into play for me right now. I eat in most of the time, and I am not getting my hair done nearly as much as I would like to. It is what it is.


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I get a little crazy when i start talking about tips, and i really need to ask myself why. It's a distinct stressor for me and i spend a disproportionate amount of time fretting over tips.

It's a real pet peeve of mine. I won't let porters carry my bags at a hotel or a car shuttle because I don't want to tip them ( i can carry my own darn bags). I want to cut my hair at home so i don't have to tip them. I don't want to eat out so i don't have to deal with the stress of tipping.

Not that I can afford hotels, shuttles, hairdressers or eating out. But in theory. smile

My one touchy spot is going to a bar. I like bars. I buy the cheapest possible beverage and start a tab so i don't have to tip after every beer. I can just leave a dollar or two when i leave. I found a bar that has a $1.50 tap beer and I try to keep my entire evening around $5.50. That's three beers and a buck tip. Big spender! :p



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Now I've done it. I've killed the conversation. This is why I was trying to keep myself out of it.

Okay, so let's set aside some suggestions if someone is poor and can't really tip.

1. Plan ahead when you go out to tip if you can, otherwise leave a nice note.
2. Learn to cut and color your own hair if you don't like to tip
3. Eat at non-sit down places where tips are not expected.

What do you guys think?

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